By continuing you agree to eChinacities's Privacy Policy .
Sign up with Google
Sign up with Facebook
Q: Is anyone else annoyed with Chinese Nationalism?
I've been watching TV and I am a little tired of hearing about China! This country is so full of itself, and full of shit too. For the love of God, I just want to escape from China sometimes. But, every single channel and every TV commercial is about China. I used to think Americans (myself included) were the biggest egotistical bigots with nothing but ethnocentric opinions. But, China definitely takes first prize. Do I hear the words "American" or "USA" as much when I watch TV back home? TV commercials included? HELL NO! But in China, that's all you hear about is China. It feels like an over-compensation of a country with a low self-esteem. This on-going hatred towards the Japanese is a little immature as well, don't you think? I mean that was almost a century ago. Japan lost the war! What else do you need? The truth is that China exploits what happened a century ago as a means to control the masses. It's a play straight from George Orwell's "1984." Keep the masses occupied and promote nationalism by creating an outside enemy. I'm a little annoyed. I feel like I'm bathing in Chinese propaganda. How about you?
Wow. Great vent post, WCG.
1. Chinese TV
Nothing good can come of watching the news here unless you enjoy a lurking sense of horror and impending rape. The sensation is probably heightened for Japanese people.
The historical dramas are good if you enjoy watching vain young women dressing up as vain young women. I don't enjoy that kind of thing, but to each his own.
And the WW2 dramas are great, if you want to be educated about how brave and stoic Chinese men are. All those stoic facial expressions. Looking stoically out windows. Standing stoically in the rain. Facing down a gun with intense stoicism. Giving other Chinese men stoic looks because you respect how stoic they are. Just great.
The other thing that I consider fucking great about Chinese war drama is the historical accuracy. Particularly how Chinese peasants killed Japanese soldiers by the dozen with improvised weapons because Chinese people are dauntless in the face of death, know martial arts, are experts at archery, and can make Japanese people explode. HISTORY!
2. Japan
I have this recurring conversation with my students (none of whose ancestors lived in Nanjing or endured Japanese occupation) whenever I mention anything good about Japan.
Student: But you don’t know what Japan did to China in history.
Me: Do you mean the Rape of Nanjing? Yes, it was an atrocity.
Student: Yes!
Me: But Mao ZeDong did far worse things. He was responsible for the deaths of tens of millions of Chinese people, many of them by public execution or torture.
Student: But that’s our own people. It’s different.
Me: …
I’d prefer to be killed by an enemy soldier than be publicly executed by the government because I went to university. But that’s just me. According to Chinese logic, one Chinese person killed by the Japanese is a far worse atrocity than 30 killed by Chairman Mao. He was a champ, you see. He did it “for the people”.
Misconceptions Chinese people have about Japan
Japan never apologised for its actions in WW2.
Japan's leaders, have, at many important political forums, on many, many occasions, apologised for their country’s actions in WW2. Including to Mao ZeDong himself. To which Mao excellently replied: “Don’t worry about it. Without you we couldn’t have defeated the National Party.”
The Communist Party defended China while the National Party refused to fight.
The exact opposite is true. This makes me seriously angry. Chinese history textbooks and war dramas have literally swapped out the National Party (who actually fought against Japan while being attacked from within China) for the Communist Party (who attacked the National Party while it was defending China against invasion). This really, really is the lowest of the low.
Japan surrendered to China, ending WW2.
It didn’t. Japan surrendered to America, or to “The Allied Forces” if we’re being generous. The declaration was made aboard a US warship with no Chinese people present.
The Rape of Nanjing justifies everlasting hatred towards Japanese people, and revenge genocide (not kidding).
What can you even say to this? Young Chinese people’s violent revenge fantasies aren’t even directed at the people who committed wartime atrocities. They’re directed at modern, civilised Japanese people living in a completely different nation 70 years after the war.
I have a Jewish friend in Australia. Despite the historical occurrence of the Holocaust, he doesn't think it would be reasonable to exact brutal revenge on modern, civilised German people. Because he's sane.
Japan hates China.
It doesn’t. Japan, as a nation, is wary of China, like all other nations are, with the additional pressure of being No.1 on China’s shitlist. The few Japanese people I’ve spoken to about China have said things like “Great country”. When the Senkaku/Diaoyu Islands thing flared up last year and Chinese people were attacking each other with bricks, smashing up cars and breaking into each other’s shops to “demonstrate” against something, Japanese people were going to work, being super-polite to each other, and buying teenage girls’ panties from vending machines the same as any other day.
It’s just you, China. It’s just Chinese people that think all their problems are caused by other countries picking on China. It’s Chinese people, not Japanese people, who have feelings of shame, impotence, persecution, inferiority, and carefully nurtured victimhood warring inside them. And it’s only Chinese people who think that all these wrongs could be righted by KILLING ANOTHER RACE.
3. Keeping the masses distracted, 1984 style
Spot on, but trying to explain the concept to a Chinese person is futile.
Me: Why are you so outraged by the conflicts between your government and foreign countries? Who do you think started those conflicts? Why does ownership of the Diaoyu Islands mean more to you than the actual problems Chinese people face? How the fuck on Earth will some contested rocks in the middle of the sea have a material effect on your life? They won’t.
But I’ll tell you what will: Air pollution, water pollution, soil pollution, toxic chemicals in food, poor job market, hyper-inflated housing market, lack of constitutional law, non-accountability of official departments, wealth disparity, misogyny, domestic violence…………
Chinese person: But the Diaoyu Islands belong to China!
CharlieB:
Spot on Samsara!
I came to China in late 2009. I am not in the teaching profession so I have limited amount of non work related conversation with most young Chinese people. I started dating my GF in 2010 about a month after she graduated from college and I was truly amazed at the inaccurate education she had about history.
1. China won WWII and saved the world from the Japanese!
2. China was the first country to develop atomic weapons.
3. America invaded China (actually they did! I was ignorant about this, as it was never mentioned in any history class while I was awake LOL)
Through extensive reeducation (lol) she now at least tries to get more than the party line. A side effect of this has actually been a distancing between her family and friends because they say she has changed. She no longer gossips about this and that, discussing fashion and such and instead tries to talk about world events. This troubles them greatly.
One quick story that nearly ended our relationship, "resulting in me "taking the gloves off" and telling her how F**cked up the way she thought back then was.
I happened to be at home watching CNN when the earth quake and resulting Tsunami hit Japan. I watched in horror as my sweet, precious, GF cheered the Tsunami, praising it, and gleefully dancing around the apartment.
I exploded!!! I rarely lose my temper, but it was epic and she had never seen me this way. I didn't speak to her for nearly a week and when I finally did I said you need to leave. Eventually I calmed down enough to explain why her behavior was so offensive to me and she took it to heart by actually logging on to the VPN and getting news other than "China approved" versions. She read Tombstone: The Great Chinese Famine, 1958-1962 by Yang Jisheng detailing in horrific detail the starvation of 36 million Chinese during the great leap forward. Detailing that it is was in fact a man made disaster and how it directly resulted in the cultural revolution which followed.
As an American I have been subjected to a lot of Pro American propaganda and as a 20 year veteran of the U. S. Army I know my countries government has committed atrocities as well.
As I have gotten older I often think of a saying my father told me all the time, "don't believe everything you read history, is written by the victor"
DrMonkey:
@CharlieB I can relate easily to your story with your gf. Thankfully, my wife have above-than-average common sense, open-mindness and compassion, she never hit the extremes once reached by your gf. From her own word, she always been 'weird', which elsewhere would be seen as 'smart'... But we once in a while we have tense conversations on such topics, it can be straining for both of us. Any argument become a personal attack, because very early on, nation, personal identity, history are all blended into one potent mix. I'm dismissive of Chinese sources, she is dismissive of non-Chinese sources, which is quite a road block, "us and them" mindset... I gave 1984 to read (it seems the Chinese translation is good), which she liked very much and definitely opened some windows. For me, trying to open windows without being manipulative, without being excessively biased, while being true to myself and without cracking the couple's harmony is a delicate balancing exercise.
avinashp:
Bulls EYE!
Obsessive-compulsive disorder
This is Chinese Nationalism! which results in whatever they did , are doing n will do!
Scandinavian:
This is why Samsera is my nominee for Phil's 2014, greatest poster. She deserves that.
The status of Mao is 70% credit for founding the country and 30% "he may have done a couple of unfortunate things"
Mateusz:
Excellent piece-by-piece, Samasra.
The logic of ethnocentric nationalism is mindboggling sometimes.
ScotsAlan:
Fantastic post. One of the best I have ever read.
You really have to buy RobK's pack on how to make money from your skill 
ScotsAlan:
Love this:
"And the WW2 dramas are great, if you want to be educated about how brave and stoic Chinese men are. All those stoic facial expressions. Looking stoically out windows. Standing stoically in the rain. Facing down a gun with intense stoicism. Giving other Chinese men stoic looks because you respect how stoic they are. Just great."
coineineagh:
Samsara, you should make this into another blog. Much easier to read through and reference. Otherwise, all this might be lost in time...
Visco8:
Hey Samsara ~ well said. May I add a couple of points;
1) Its an old Govt. ploy to have a common enemy e.g. Japan so that the populace forget about the many domestic problems they have,. e.g. pollution, corruption etc & simply focus on the 'demon' enemy.
2) in all the terrible anti- Japanese war movies on TV , a USA flag is never to be seen!! It seems the Chinese defeated the Japanese by themselves, & the Japs are always perceived as stupid/comedic
3) I had one very perceptive male student in BJ that said to me..'do you know why we really hate the Japs..its cos they are such a small country & we are so big. The FACE thing..
I see Japanese Navy boats and those damned rocks on a weekly basis, it's been years, there are way more important things (real estate bubble, pollution, rule of the law, education, public debt, inequalities) which requires urgent efforts... Those images makes me angry, I have to fight the urge to throw something at the TV. Most useful rocks ever, and I speak for both sides.
Nessquick:
yeah, everytime i take a metro, I should not miss a 10 minute long spot about islands, war ships, army training and some specialist long talks ...
Last night our TV was stuck on a drama about Chairman Mao. What a piece of crap to put on in prime time. I am sure it is fiction rather than fact. That it glorifies the man, and that it is presented as historically accurate.
Also, over the last days, several times on WeChat, I've seen people post a story that a Japanese Brewery has bought Tsingtao and has helped fund the purchase of some islands. It is shocking how uncritical people are in what they read and blurt on to others. Generally people are completely uncritical if things are labelled "Chinese". Greatest country on earth, yeah, and I have the firmest butt on earth.
Nessquick:
I have seen on wechat some crap about japanese cars bad quality, while they have minor accident with chinese cars. japs was damaged too much, while qq or the "wuling" minivan almost without scratch. for me and my wife, very likely staged photos and lot of crap around.
this is for fact, that most of the car parts in the " bumper zone" is produced now of plastic instead of steel as years ago, but still the QQ can not beat the " Honnecker limousine" - Trabant ..
They forgot, that the japanese cars used in China are made in china, by chinese workers from chinese suppliers and under the chinese managers and supervisors with chinese majority in the company ...
Scandinavian:
they also forget that Chinese cars are copies of Japanese cars, but without using same material quality so structural strength, or lack hereof, will not make minor accidents survivable. (with the exception that Volvo is technically a Chinese car company, and they have the claimed goal to make it impossible to die in a Volvo from 2020)
WCG:
@Nessquick. Quick note: If a car doesn't fold like an accordion, then it is a primitive design. Japanese, German and American made automobiles are designed to absorb the impact of a collision so the passengers DON'T. A car made of solid steel is more dangerous than one designed to absorb the impact. That wechat episode is probably accurate. Maybe the Chinese car barely had a scratch on it, but the passengers are dead from rattling around in a steel cage. It's called physics. Jerk, the derivative of acceleration. Did they test the jerk, or did they stop at acceleration?
Scandinavian:
http://www.euroncap.com/Content-Web-Article/d6abd1b4-a7a9-47d9-a565-d4566d1f7d38/euro-ncap-publishing-first-chinese-vehicle-rating.aspx
Yeah. Two stars for a second attempt (I am aware the Quoros 5 has since vindicated the proud tradition of Chinese automaking, but that is also European engineering behind that project)
Just remember, that all TV programming is done by the government! Of course, they want to embellish everything.
And this ...
These 3 days in Shanghai are very bright, AQI is bellow 100 and you can see lot of interviews with specialist, lot of sh1t people talking about AQI, even newspoaper, probably part of propaganda, how the goverment have implemented great tools to fight pollution which resulted in clear sky almost immediately !!! ahhaaa
Scandinavian:
maybe they are recording some interviews for future use on days where the sky is black
It's not all bad. For one, it allows Americans to feel immensely humble.
You can swagger around with a "These Colors Don't Run" shirt while listening to Toby Keith and ranting about "Them A-rabs, 'n' Mexicans taking our jobs 'n' wimmin!", lecture people about how America saved the world from the Nazis, and still feel like an open-minded liberal.
Scandinavian:
I am not A-merican and I simply cannot tell if sarcasm was used here or not. (can you tell if sarcasm is used in my comment?)
coineineagh:
At least you'd *know* you're being a bigot. Much like how 3rd world countries *know* they need better education and have to fight corruption. Then there is potential for improvement. There's so much pigheadedness and self-delusion in this country, that I feel worried for the future of the world. China is for the Chinese, and Chinese are perfection. If foreigners think China should change, of course they are wrong.
What we hear from Wang Ray and Jane Way (names are changed to protect the innocent and are coincidental) is mostly gov't propaganda aimed at the Chinese who are trying to learn English. The conversation is slanted. The gov't must redirect the attention of the people it rules away from the domestic problems. I also find this is bordering on inciting the population to go to war. The limited thinking ability of the combined minds of the gov't don't realize that in todays age going to war with Japan will mean the breakup of China from within at the very least.
Of course it's annoying, but whatever, this country is going absolutely nowhere as long as it lasts anyway, so why bother. Chinese themselves should feel upset, not me.
The whole "China Dream" thing is also pretty annoying.. asked a few Chinese mates about what they thought of it and they are not as gullible or blindly optimistic as others are.
American dream, China dream.. who gives a crap.
TMaster:
I don't know if people know this, but every Chinese president has to make up his catchphrase, it's a tradition. The precedent was the infamous "harmonious society". "Chinese Dream" is Xi's.
And it's actually a good picture of today's China : unimaginative, vainly running after whatever the US already created a while ago, falsely naive, emotional instead of rational, and ultimately pursuing... well, a "dream", because that's what it is.
masonk:
Exactly, weirdly enough "China Dream" does reflect a few things in Chinese society, like as you mentioned it's basically a 'copied' dream, much like everything else China copies, fakes and commercializes.
It gets tiring from any country it comes from. I am happy many countries are number one, but the rest of us just want to live in peace.
I have an aunt who is very nationalistic. She talks about Mexico like it were paradise on earth, but why do millions want to leave every year? It reminds me of China.
donnie3857:
Reminds me of something about America. Everyone hates her but when the chips are down they ask: When will the Americans come to help?" or "It's America's fault but I want to live there". Many people all over the world hate America too, but so many are dying trying to get in. As a Canadian I don't like America much either. The Americans I know are good people. I am glad she is Canada's neighbor. Sure would beet having China as a neighbor.
Just finished my first visit to this post and I want to congratulate the poster, WCG, and Samsara for their efforts. And the other contributors too.
I live in China and the collective thinking of the Chinese people is my most unfathomable experience. Well, you know what I mean.
Me; "Two more beers please mate."
Him; .......zzzzzzzz
Me; "Two more beers when you're ready please mate."
Him; .......heheh....
Me; "Hey mate, do you think you could give us two more beers please?"
Him; "Do you want more beer?"
Me; "Gees, mate. Yes, we do. Can we have two more beers now please."
Him; .....zzzzzzzzzzzz
Me; "Hey mate.....give us a couple of beers willya for fksake!"
Him; "You want more beer. Ok, I get for you."
Time passes...... no beer coming.
Me; "Hey mate, what are you doing? What kind of place is this? Give us some more fkn grog!"
Him; "Yes, I get beer."
Time passes......
Me; "Fuk you mate...give us beer or I'll fukn kill ya!"
Him; "Oh, you want beer. Ok."
And so on and so on..... Finally.....the barman is found dead.
I agree with you but most countries get nationalistic, you can't really blame them for believing in their own country even when they are not a strong country. The fact of the matter is that in a communist country where the media is controlled by the state then there will be more nationalistic programming than in democratic nations.
At the end of the day we are guests in China and have no right to say that we are tired of hearing Chinese people be nationalistic, imagine if a Chinese guy was in the US and went into a bar and said "I am tired of hearing about American Patriotism and how you guys think you save the world!"...It just doesn't work like that, that guy would probably get glassed!
You have to either listen to it and get over it or get out! Simple as that. Sure we can try and teach them that some facts are not correct but if they choose to listen and learn it is up to them.
Hope I haven't seemed to negative about your rant, I do agree with you and we all need to get some of the pressure out sometimes, just please be careful about where you say it. Here is fine but don't go yelling it to your Chinese friends or colleagues! Just a heads up!
Hotwater:
Agree with most of what you say except for this "It just doesn't work like that, that guy would probably get glassed!"....nope, in America you'd probably get shot. In the UK you'd most probably get glassed!
hiddenjelly:
I'm from the UK so I guess I mixed the two up, forgot for a moment Americans have guns! haha
sam239:
I have kept Chinese friends my entire life in the States and never once brought out the sort of arrogant dangerous nationalism rampant here (I type as the awful roar of jet fighters from the nearby military outlet roars overhead). Never heard it from American of Canadian Chinese either. You would have to be around some a~holes for that to happen in the US, plus with the whole multicultural spiel it has become socially unacceptable to appear in anyway close~minded. Also saying he should pack up and leave is totally unhelpful and a bit dickish.
Yes annoyed. In fact I have already typed a draft of a post about "how you respond to aggressive nationalism". I don't watch TV but find it comes up often in conversation. Typically the people with the aggressive nationalism are English-speaking Chinese who are going abroad or spend all their time copying off of westerners. Ironically I don't get it from the working class Chinese (maybe partly because I don't have a clue what they're saying) but from the corrupt nouveaux riche $hits; they have this childish need to see themselves as superior and higher than everyone else. Very ironic. I have a feeling their arrogance will end up being their downfall.
bill8899:
This ^
I'm sick of the one guy in class who's trying to trap me into saying something, anything bad about China. Do they get a prize for this? Oh, and he earned a C when he could have aced the class.
Oh, and now I want Cheez-Its! Dam you!
:D
Scandinavian:
@bill. You could start of easy by doing some broad generalizations like. "All Chinese have worse table manners than people in the west" which I believe holds true in the western understanding of table manners.
bill8899:
Scan, thanks for the suggestions but I'm not interested in opening any doors. If they want to use baidu exclusively after they emigrate then so be it. I don't argue about politics at all. In fact I dodge the topic whenever it's around as I'm not interested in discussing politics anywhere, China or not.
And I still need some Cheez-Its!
When the whole Island thing was at its worst, one of my Chinese friends actually said he wanted to invade Japan and rape and kill the Japs! I was honestly taken aback, I had assumed he was kind of sensible, but like most others he just believes everything he is told on TV.
Another time I am at a restaurant having dinner, the news is on in the back, sound turned off, the first 15 minutes were about those bloody islands and Abe, they don't even pretend not to be pedaling propaganda, but again, no one understood when I tried to point out the blatant manipulation going on.
i love it when they talk about the islands,
my first answer is walk the walk, dont just talk the talk, china and japan start the war tomorrow, the number 2 and number 3 economies in the world kill each other , so america can be even further ahead of you in the future, please start fighting tomorrow, they usually look shocked and surprised by the answer and I politely say, i look out for what is best for america and you look out for what is best for china, may the best win. america has large treasury debt to both countries and we can with hold payments to both countries for creating a hostile global crisis.
it totally blows the mind of a chinese person when i say fight, the sooner the better.
china is full of too many people and japan is full of old people, what is china afraid of, grab a gun and start shooting, walk the walk, dont waste my time with talk the talk.
coineineagh:
Genius! You called their bluff AND shut them up! Maybe I should pretend to not care about China - it's like intimidating them into behaving like adults.
