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Posts: 1098

Shifu

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Q: Bizarrely ignorant statements comparing China to other countries

I taught my uni. students the term "culture shock" and asked them to define it and give an example on their final exam. One student defined it correctly and then explained that in Japan people are loud when eating and in China people are quiet. So when Chinese go to Japan and see all the people speaking loudly, they will be very surprised by this behavior.

Now, in all fairness I have never been to Japan but from what I hear people are quiet and civilized while in China...... yikes. If this is quiet, I can only imagine what noisy sounds like. People in restaurants in China often speak so loudly that I expect a fight to break out at any moment only to see them laughing and getting along. How on earth could anyone actually believe this? What are some of the most ridiculous statements you have heard comparing China to any parts of the vast nation of Wai guo?  

9 years 12 weeks ago in  General  - China

 
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In comparison with other countries, anything that has to do with statistics ends up with "... of course there are many <insert horrible fact> because there are so many people in China". Then you go on to try to explain "per capita" and you just get the same ".... sooooo many people" remark again and again and again. 

Can't vote for gubbermint with so many people (unless you are India) 

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I lived in Japan, people there DO actually make noise when eating in one situation, when slurping noodles, it means the noodles taste great and not making noise can offend the chef/cook/whoever made the noodles. They do NOT make noise when eating anything else however. And you are right about Japanese not talking loudly, except for street advertisers because that's their job, they are always quiet, during my stay there the only time I have heard people shouting (talking) in public they were Chinese (and yes from Mainland China, you can see it on their faces, and in their behavior).

Shining_brow:

I haven't been there, but had been told by some who have lived there for a few years - it's extremely bad form to even have a phone-chat (even in a very quiet voice) on the subway. The usual tactic is either to ignore the phone, or to quickly tell them you're on the subway and that you'll ring them back later.

 

Now, THAT is polite! (overboard, IMHO, but anyway)

9 years 12 weeks ago
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Eorthisio:

That's true, people tend to use texts in the subway. Discreet and humble are two good adjectives to describe people in Japan, in China it would be obnoxious and oblivious.

9 years 12 weeks ago
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hunny797:

no phone chat on a subway??? how does that qualify as polite?

there is no harm in talking in a slow voice that doesnt disturb others..

it's a subway, not a meeting.

9 years 12 weeks ago
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Shining_brow:

@Hunny - I did say I thought it was overboard. But, it's 'polite' because it's considering other people on the subway, instead of not bothering to think about them at all. You know, an attempt to show 'respect' to others....

9 years 12 weeks ago
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Eorthisio:

hunny797 -> That's about considering other people, here I see the opposite, people screaming in their phones on public transports even when it's quiet in there and sometimes I really want to grab their phone to throw it through the windows.

 

Also the MTR/subway over there in Tokyo is the cleanest in the world, despite having the highest number of daily commuters (the Yamanote line is by far the busiest in the world). You could eat on the floor and probably not get sick if you were allowed to eat there, yes eating and drinking is forbidden on public transportation in Japan.

9 years 12 weeks ago
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Shifu

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Russians drink a lot....well yes they do...but this was coming from a guy drinking baijiu at lunch time...

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Chinese people are very healthy because they eat lots of vegetables. Foreigners are very unhealthy because we eat a lot of meat. Said at a table where all the Chinese were eating meals consisting only of noodles and oil and I was the only one with veggies on my plate.

Do they really think that all westerners have exactly the same diet?

Eorthisio:

Some of them seriously think that fast food (e.g. McDonald's) is "Western food" as our national cuisine, so much ignorance.

9 years 12 weeks ago
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Lord_hanson:

McDonalds isn't the nation dish of America? Next you will tell me that Taco bell isn't Mexico's national dish!

9 years 12 weeks ago
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frvioque:

I dont agree. Chinese food is one of the unhealthiest in the world, they use recycle oil, everything pretty dirty, in fact chinese quality food is one of the most serious problems in china. 

9 years 12 weeks ago
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Scandinavian:

Further than that. The quality of the food in China is really low. Meats and vegetables are treated like garbage before it reaches the consumer. E.g. the common belief is that frozen vegetables "are bad" when in fact they would have lost way less nutrients than the so-called fresh vegetables. 

When it comes to diet, most countries have some kind of institution that continuously updates the people on what is best. For China, if the public was told they are eating garbage, there would probably be a lot of people running around with pitchforks. Ignorance is bliss. 

9 years 12 weeks ago
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Shining_brow:

I'll actually say that the Chinese diet is, in fact, very healthy... it's just that in modern times, the food production mechanism is crap. Thus, if someone had good quality vegies and meats, then yes, it would be very healthy!! That differs considerably from people who deliberately choose to eat unhealthy stuff (ie, the snack foods, cokes etc that many also consume... around the world).

9 years 12 weeks ago
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Eorthisio:

I have to agree with Shining_brow, the traditional Chinese diet is very healthy, they ate mostly vegetables and staple food like rice or noodles, proteins mostly came from tofu and other soy products.

 

Today however is different, as income grew meat products have invaded the Chinese tables, not that I am vegetarian but force is to admit that a diet containing many animal products is not healthy and people here are some of the biggest meat consumers I have seen, more than we are back in Germany, especially considering the standards of production here in China.

 

When it comes to non-animal products what is concerning today is that most vegetables and crops are grown on soils seriously contaminated with heavy metals and other chemicals, especially with alarming quantities of cadmium used in most factories and released in nature and farmlands that has been proved to badly damage brain cells and lead to mental issues such as insanity in the long run.

 

If China didn't pollute its environment and chose instead a clean economic model, as well as enforcing laws and standards when it comes to food production, then yes the Chinese diet would be without any doubt one of the healthiest in the world along with other Asian diets (Japanese and Korean notably), sadly this is not the case and anything grown/produced in China will be contaminated for the next centuries because of levels of pollution never reached anywhere else in the world and not "cleanable" without massive economic losses.

9 years 12 weeks ago
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Shifu

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Besides the general "There are two countries: China and Foreignland", I've heard that all Waiguoren are Christen, and so, get married in church.

 

Also, Waiguoren all eat meat, so therefore, at every lunch or dinner provided meat almost exclusively, despite me constantly saying that I am a vegan (and explaining it). The reasoning still is, "You are waiguoren, and therefore, you eat only meat."

 

 

DrMonkey:

Because I'm vegetarian, my in-laws seems to assume that Westerns are likely to be vegetarians, now ^^ My parents came, eating meat. Confusion followed : what, people have different habits ? But... but... same country, same family ! Waiguoren are so confusing.

9 years 12 weeks ago
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coineineagh:

In the past, people of different religions were defined by how they ate meat. "Shuns pork people", "extract sinews people". They're still trying to classify laowai with this same method to this day. "likes beef people" - is a misunderstanding. Laowai order beef here because they are "shuns splintered bones, skin, entrails and other parts of animals that were covered in shit - people".

9 years 12 weeks ago
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Shining_brow:

Does this mean that Chinese should be called "Offal eating people"??? :p

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I had quite often caused a lot of surprise when mentioning that pretty much every European country have its own language, like : in Italy, people speaks Italian. Also, that we all have different habits, such as what we eat for breakfast, work culture, etc.

Eorthisio:

But, waiguoren all speak English as their first tongue, except when hiring FTs then only those from US, Canada, UK, OZ and NZ are native English speakers. We like double standards in China.

9 years 12 weeks ago
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Bizarrely, many Chinese I speak to cannot grasp the notion that many festivals that are held in China are not celebrated in Western countries. The most common misapprehension is why we do not head for home at Spring Festival. Then detecting the shock and horror when they told that Spring Festival is based on the lunar calendar which most western nationals do not recognize or follow thus not celebrated.

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Or that no conversation can be had on baijiu because it's only consumed in China and no where else.

Unlike, for example, saki and sujo.

 

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Too many....

 

Firstly, as said, "westerners" only eat hamburgers and pizza, and drink coffee and beer (although, usually not at the same time).

 

Obviously, we know NOTHING about China - its history, culture or its language.

 

All foreigners are completely independent (but still we all love our parents/family), and have kids when we want. We don't feel any obligation to get married or have kids, and we only date someone to have sex with them (ie, no sense of commitment).

 

Only China has Chinese, and any Chinese-looking person must speak fluent Chinese (regardless of hundreds of years of emigration to other countries, and the loss of culture and language). Thus, Chinese-looking people are incapable of speaking any other language fluently enough to be able to teach it. Any non-Chinese person is incapable of grasping even the most basics of Putonghua.

 

Australia is hot (temperature)... regardless of the fact that it's almost as large as China, and has vast variations in weather across the nation. A town of only 5000 people must be extremely undeveloped (ie, no power, water, etc, let alone internet or TV). Australia also only has 2 animals - kangaroo and koala (although, to be fair on that, that's what most people around the world seem to think Tongue)

 

 

DrMonkey:

Everybody knows that Australia have 3 animals : koala, kangaroos, and bogans ^^

9 years 12 weeks ago
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Shifu

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I really don't get the "What is the weather like in America?" Have you seen a map? Do you really think Alaska and Florida have the same climate?

Robk:

That question would be just as stupid when asking about China. 

 

Ask someone in Harbin and ask someone in Sanya... 

 

So it's not ignorance on geography (like from another country)... it's just pure ignorance of Chinese people.

9 years 12 weeks ago
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I've been here too long, more than 7 years, and longer than that in SEA, so I can tell u that most people don't know shit from shinola when it comes to 'telling' me about the US. (and I've given up clarifying any of their statements long ago)  yes, we all drink coffee 24/7 and pack heat.

 

The reason is, I think, is that they get their info from movies, news (second, third, or fourth-hand) and they slowly but surely think that what they have heard/seen is how it is.  but an even deeper problem is that most I have ever met have never even bothered to think about it with their own intellect.  that is what shocks me the most!  they are sooooooooo perfect for brain-washing.  just tell them something, and they accept it.  ....... the stories I could tell...  lol

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Shifu

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Another one I love is the assumption that anyone abroad who lives in the countryside is poor. I love when they ask derogatorily whether someone is from the countryside, which automatically would make that person a toothless hillbilly in their minds. I've tried explaining that many suburban areas have higher median incomes than New York City but they don't seem to get it. They assume that the whole world is like China so everyone who can afford to be in a big city must be living in one. They don't get when I explain that my parents left New York City to retire in a small town. "
They must just assume my parents are too poor. 

Nessquick:

yeah, I noticed that too, when I said my hometown is about 4,500 people living in, they made that "woo" and that eye sight, like where the hell you came from ? My "village" have 5 pubs, factories from pre-WW2 era, 2 trainstations and 6 bus stations, church, 2 school buildings of 3 storey each, 3 kindergardens, cinema, several parks, and so on. Okay, it is old, many buildings are older then 100 years, specialy those in town centre, but hey. compare it to chinese "city of 200.000people ...

9 years 12 weeks ago
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DrMonkey:

Those backward countryside towns with a public library, kindergarten, public schools that would pass for elite private ones in a 1st tiers city, and more cultural events going on that in a 3rd tiers city of 5 millions people. Depending on which part of Waiguoistan you live in, you might be loaded with centuries old walls, bridges, buildings. And it's not even noisy. So boring, so backward, no shopping malls and shops close the Sunday, so ma fan ^^

9 years 12 weeks ago
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Scandinavian:

ah yes, our xmas vacation to a small town in the countryside made waves when pictures emmerged on WeChat of us in front of stuff of Scandinavian design in rooms without mold on the walls. 

then some asks about the price of the house we are in, which is really cheap compared to a shitty flat in Zhuhai and this makes them then spiral back to us being pretty poor in the countryside

In China. Country side = uneducated farmer, which is a tragic fact about China

9 years 12 weeks ago
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Nessquick:

yeah, house prices on country side. in my wife hometown some people claimed to make new house, un-insulated, bad arrangement, stick to other house by wall, no garden but concrete foreground, for about 200.000rmb. in my hometown, just 5 minutes walk to German borders, I can get decent older "villa" or family house, some decades old, do some repairs, change water pipes, electro installation, insulation, decorate it and you have super duper extra living place for another decades, with big garden, fruit trees, veggie growing place, dog house, for about slightly more, if you go hard for size and deco, so double that amount.

Yet, we are still poor countryside , with all the bellow mentioned facilities.. if needed, so about 2hrs bus ride to Prague for work and evening back. it will be similar as in Shanghai , where many people need at least 1 hour in metro to reach workplace, but can not compare that. never ever. I wish I go back soon. But I told myself, another 2 years in this company will be very worth it.

9 years 12 weeks ago
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wagon:

I tried to explain this over the weekend.  How schools are funded by tax dollars and suburban schools are better than inner-city schools, in most situations, because of tax base.  The complete opposite of here. 

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Not to disparage my wife, as she is adapting to modern life with me quite well, but sometimes there's a shocking residu of ignorance that needs to be scraped off. When discussing the move to Europe:
Me: "We still have to think of our kids' long-term future. Education in Europe is good, but getting a car and maybe a house for them will be expensive."
Her: "Don't worry about the house and car. In Europe, we don't have to get that for our kids."
Me: "But a house and car are still useful in Europe. If we can give them something, we should at least try."
Her: "You are becoming more like a Chinese."

RIDDLE: What's wrong with that last statement, and who can guess my response to it? Hint: The answer should include the term FACE/mianzi.

dongbeiren:

So your wife is  admitting that in most places in China a house is a bad investment at current prices? That cars in China are ridiculously overpriced and often more of a burden than a necessity (depending on a person's situation)? That people in China go into massive debt for these things even though it's often against their interest? Oh yea, so they're for MIANZI. Do Chinese  get that in many parts of America and Europe cars are a necessity rather than a luxury? That home ownership actually means OWNERSHIP. Amazing how Chinese feel no sense of safety without owning a home when 1. The government owns it and 2. The common person must take on a massive debt load to buy the place so where's the security? Lose your job and better hope the family will pay the mortgage for you. 

9 years 12 weeks ago
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coineineagh:

Nice try. My actual response was that she only wanted to get house and car for our kids in China, because mianzi pressures her to. While I want what's best for my kids no matter what other people say or don't say. That's called love, and it doesn't make me more Chinese. Anyway, my wife admitted her error (by silence), and I didn't let it become an issue. Life in Europe will be a challenge where she must learn to augment the system that keeps society running, rather than finding exploitable vulnerabilities to game the system. My wife truly loves our kids; she just needs to get out of this place to get rid of bad habits.

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Scandinavian:

"If you love your kids you raise them so they can get their own house and car !" said by no one in China EVER

9 years 12 weeks ago
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alexanderrz:

Almost 2 and a half year since my wife is in europe.....she is not "ready" yet but will get there :)

9 years 11 weeks ago
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Shifu

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I was once talking to some people who sending advertising papers around. Once they realized that I am from such a small country as Czech republic is, they laughed that we sure do not have railways, because we do not need them. Oh, the lack of knowledges when among the world first railways was developed there, to city of Wien. and that we have had about 90% of each village , towns and cities covered by network of rails, only recently declining numbers of usage of tracks, as more and more people get cars and buses and better and faster than many years ago was.

Some common things, as we eat hamburgers for lunch and surprised why do not eat rice everyday, why we eat soup before main course, not on the end of feast like here. Christmas are like chinese new year. 

Do you have pencils in your country ?

Shining_brow:

Czech Republic has pencils?? WOW!

9 years 12 weeks ago
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Nessquick:

yes, but didn't have any until we came to Yiwu bought few containers to make our kids happy and curious :D

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This is not quite answering your question however, I also had exam a few days ago, with College students, the question: 'Which country would you NOT like to visit? & Why?'

 

Over a third said..yep..Japan! & why? cos they are terrible people, did many bad things in China...?

 

Needless to say, I was disappointed & somewhat surprised, these young people are going to keep this shit going on? It did happen over 70yrs ago folks, terrible as it was.

 

Still listening to the Govt. pushing the buttons...as it pleases them to do so.

 

However, it was nice  to hear a few students actually wanted to go to Japan, they had been told how quiet & civilised it was there....still some hope for China.

Scandinavian:

sad to se Japan "win" over Iran, Congo and other such gardens of eden. 

9 years 12 weeks ago
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Eorthisio:

Yep, sad indeed. However I have some hope when seeing the young teenagers.

 

I am not a teacher anymore but work for an educational company and last time I had to cover F.2 students in IGCSE classes (13~14 years old kids), the subject of the class was "Self-Introduction" as this was the first time I had them. I asked them to write it first then to come at the teacher's desk to read it. I gave them some guidelines: Name, Age, Birthplace, Hobbies, Life goals, Travel, Dream job.

 

When it came to where they would like to travel the most, the vast majority of them said the US, Australia and Japan, about the same number for each of these places. I took notice and asked them why Japan, many said Japan is good and they hope that China would be more like it. There was also surprisingly few "I want to become rich" in their life goals, but many "I want to make the world a better place" or "I want to create a better China". This gives me hope.

 

I have also heard teenagers in China openly talking about the Tiananmen events, saying that "it was wrong", when I asked who was wrong they said "the government" not the protesters.

 

This gives me hope that China will become a better place, but it will not as long as the country is ruled by people who worship money more than freedom.

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Shining_brow:

I totally agree, Ethorsio!!! (though my kids still say they want to be rich.. How? Become a businessman (even the girls! :p)

 

I'm shocked, however, that your kids even know about TMS!

9 years 12 weeks ago
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Eorthisio:

They know about Tiananmen events because my employer hires teachers from Hong Kong for most classes from science to general studies in the IGCSE program (that spread across many schools in Guangdong) and some of the teachers don't hesitate to tell their students about topics that are normally forbidden here in Mainland China. They also heard about the recent protests in HK from a different perspective than that of CCTV.

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I have heard them all

my favorite is when i am told 'facts' about my home country that make me laugh out loud - some of them i wish were true.

The one i would like is that you can get a marriage license that lasts for 5 years 

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Shifu

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The text in one of my university-level classes contained the wod consumerism. Rather than just define the word myself, I asked my students what it meant. Without missing a beat, oneof my students said 'It's what they have in countries like America (I can only assume he meant the USA), where the people are lazy and only care about money.'

Yes, he was serious. Yes, he was gaping at his smartphone the entire time he was talking to me.

Lord_hanson:

Your student will make a fine member of the communist party, if he can lower his IQ somehow he might even make it to the top.

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I think this one needs to be said at some stage... so here goes...

 

It's sort of "bizarrely", it's most definitely "ignorant" (granted, it's an enforced ignorance, and it's a "statement".. however, in itself, it isn't a "comparison", although there's plenty of history for which such comparisons can be made...

 

Q: Why do you hate Japan?

A: Because of what they did to China during the war.

Q: That was more than 50 years ago - why do you still hate them now?

A: Because they've never apologised for it!

Q: Did you know that the Japanese government and officials have publicly apologized more than 20 times since that time? And it's all on record, and done in front of media and other officials?

 

A: ..... but but but....

 

(odd that as I was reading through the list on Wiki of those official apologies, the page (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_war_apology_statements_issued_by_Japan) got a "connection reset".... Seems like the CCP doesn't even want people to know this either! Though, I can read it all now... hmmmm)

Eorthisio:

The leaders' line is "look over there (at Japan) while we are making a mess over here".

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Nessquick:

you know, some people belive, that japanese kids are learning about the right things what they did to china, and that its not bad. I really have been told this. by proud commie member. I asked him, if he is reading japanese school books, if he is so sure... blank stare and bit of smile as reply...

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Shining_brow:

Nessquick, I also looked at the Wiki entry on the Japanese schoolbook controversy... interesting to note that of the textbooks that are being argued about, less than half of 1% of the Japanese schools are actually using them!

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Maybe a little off tangent but....

 

What I really don't get is how every time someone mentions anything remotely negative about China, even if it's not meant in a negative way the answer is often 'well in the U.S.A ...' as if that somehow justifies something and makes it ok.

 

ME. God that recent kindergarten killing was horrible.. hope they throw the book at the bastard who did it.

DEFENSIVE FRIEND: well in the U.S kids shoot up schools all the time !

 

ME: I think I'm getting another cough/cold, wish the wind would pick up and clear away some of the smog.

DEFENSIVE FRIEND: America has air pollution too !

 

A POSTER: The hukou system is making it hard to get my child in a school here.

DEFENSIVE REPLY: Well the healthcare system in the States is bad too !

 

 

Shining_brow:

Well in America, whenever someone posts a negative thing about them they always.... something... I think.....

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That blacks are so dirty but Chinese take showers everyday. Some women like to cover their nose when they pass me...eventhough I took a shower..plastered underarms with Right Guard and sprayed myself with BurBerry

iWolf:

".plastered underarms with Right Guard and sprayed myself with BurBerry"

 

This could be the problem.

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I had a student who will study in the US ask if we have crabs(the food, the food!)  I showed him a picture of the famous Fisherman's Wharf sign in San Francisco with the crab on it.  Instantly, the student went into a defensive posture.  "They're not the same as the famous river crabs here!"  It must suck to go through life with that sort of mentality. 

Nessquick:

yeah, that should be hard for him...

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"The famous..XYZ"

 

Wagon just reminded me of another comparison problem - the concept of fame.

 

TBH, when I came to China, I was fairly ignorant of a lot of things - especially geography. (I even had a phone interview where I showed my ignorance in China only having 1 timezone!!) Thus, places like Hangzhou, Suzhou, Nanjing, that are incredibly famous meant nothing to me. Same also with their four famous mountains, lakes, etc etc (why are there "Four famous X", yet 4 is an unlucky number??)

 

And yet, things that we know about and take for granted are a complete mystery to them... in this regard, I'm thinking things like the Parthenon, Colloseum, Taj Mahal, Stonehenge or Machu Picu, Roman and Greek Empires, places like Prague and St Petersburg. Sure they may have heard of such things, but that's about where their knowledge stops.

 

The same could be said for contemporary persons... Jay Z may be 'famous' here, but most of my class had never heard of Pink Floyd, The Eagles, Led Zeppelin (and only know 1 or 2 songs from Queen - and not Bohemian Rhapsody!!)

DrMonkey:

 Ask, back home, to name 3 Chinese provinces ^^

9 years 12 weeks ago
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Shining_brow:

Yes, I know... I can do the same for people on this forum about Australian states and territories! :D But I am referring to things that are relatively 'famous' outside the country..

9 years 12 weeks ago
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rasklnik:

I'd say most people could name Tibet and Sichuan because of politics and food, and technically Taiwan is a province, so I think most educated people could name 3 Chinese provinces.

9 years 12 weeks ago
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Lord_hanson:

A lot of students anywhere in the world probably wouldn't have heard of those in my opinion excellent bands but that is more to do with the fact that they are from a different generation.

9 years 12 weeks ago
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bill8899:

What are Hangzhou, Suzhou and Nanjing incredibly famous for? 

 

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