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Q: Signing A Contract At An Unlicensed School.
What's the point in signing anything? It would be like signing a contract with your drug dealer stating certain stipulations on the process of your drug deal. If one of you break this contract you can't go running to the cops with this contract, so why even do it?
A contract seems to me only should be used in legal scenarios where lawful agreements are happening.
Like if say the unlicensed employer told you they would give you so many RMB's, and shorted you or never paid you, There nothing you can do, I guess you go vigilante, but I'm talking legal ways.
Why not just go with spoken agreements until one of you fucks the other over? Makes more sense and easier to deal with it would seem.
7 years 1 week ago in Business & Jobs - China
the school will usually dont tell you that they are illegal and to make the fake face look real, they give you a contract.
if both parties know, of course a contract from legal side is useless. But sometime you still can tell the boss "hey, you wrote it down here" so if he need you, he will follow it.
biggj123:
Good point, I guess its better to have something than nothing. In this case though it seems better to have nothing lol.
Because in China you the foreigner are the one who will bear the brunt of any repercussions.
The school will just get a slap on the wrist and then praised for bringing you to the governments attention.
You know honor among criminals and that.
Chinese interpretation of right and wrong is different to foreign ....
the school will usually dont tell you that they are illegal and to make the fake face look real, they give you a contract.
if both parties know, of course a contract from legal side is useless. But sometime you still can tell the boss "hey, you wrote it down here" so if he need you, he will follow it.
biggj123:
Good point, I guess its better to have something than nothing. In this case though it seems better to have nothing lol.
The contract is worthless and meaningless.
Everything could go well or go could go horribly wrong.
I'm leaning towards the latter.
biggj123:
Well if the job is legit then the contracts means something...not alot, but something...where as illegal means nothing.
Zethe:
Wrong. If the school is unlicensed, the contract is meaningless. It is only meaningful if recognized by the law.
Contract Definition: a written or spoken agreement, especially one concerning employment, sales, or tenancy, that is intended to be enforceable by law.
The only "meaning" it has is metaphorical. This metaphorical meaning of "reaching compromise" can just as easily be done verbally AND have the benefit of being less incriminating (which I think you pointed out earlier).
Signed and stamped Contract isn't worthless .... at least my Contracts never were!
If party A doesn't respect the Contract, one should dial Foreign Expert Bureau (SAFEA) and ask them for their opinion and help. SAFEA is there to issue WP, FEC and to mediate disputes between both parties.
Anybody wants to talk to SAFEA enter 'SAFEA' in search above for address and contact no. in every Province ....
Legally, Contract is worthless, if party A doesn't hold 'laowai hire authorization', which is granted to School by SAFEA.
You should ask School to show such authorization, before you ink the Contract!
'Laowai hire authorization' looks very similar to FEC, and it is necessary to see such cert., especially when FT is transferring the Residence permit to new sponsor.
There is another way to check, if School can hire foreigners.
http://www.anesl.com/schools/ info.asp?province=Guangdong& keyword=University&cmd=Search
Change parameters (city/Province, School's level) and see, if School you are applying hold 'foreign hire authorization'.
Web link above is some 5 years old and it isn't updated. I rarely use it and I instead ask School to show me the file of their 'laowai hire auth.'.
You must see certificate, before you sign the Contract!
biggj123:
I'm not saying the schools is trying to trick you, I'm saying if both parties agree to the illegal employment....why bother with a contract? It's not binding anyway.
icnif77:
I am saying, many Schools are trying to trick you or they are just plain stupid.
1. I completed the Contract in Fuk, Xinjiang and signed new Contract with School in Taizhou, Jiangxi-I think!
I arrived to Taizhou with some 25 days left on 30-days RP extension, which is sufficient time for School to get new FEC, ME and new Contract length RP.
School asked me to step into the classroom next day after my arrival. It was end of May ....After 25 days of working, rep told me, SAFEA won't give new FEC to NNES ... I dialled Jianxi SAFEA and they told me "Taizhou School doesn't have 'laowai hire cert.''
Bastards, they offered Contract to NNES with ready excuse!
2 days later, I was in Tsim Sha Tsui, looking for the new Z visa sponsor over Internet.
Taizhou School hired me for June&July& 'then you can leave ...' with full year Contract!
I had valid RP, no China exit required! Year 2013!
2. I signed new Contract with Uni in Kaifeng, Henan. I arrived there from Fujian with 30-days S2 visa. By Chinese law, everything was c&d .... Henan Uni could apply for new FEC and got new Contract length RP, buTT .... they recently 
applied for 'laowai hire cert.' and couldn't do anything with Gov., but I had to exit China few days before end of S2 and apply for new Z.
Henan SAFEA required new Z visa can be applied only in one's home country ... That means, mei-you-HK, but return home (EU) and wait for the new WP and Invitation letter with signed Contract in view .. It took 90 days to get new Z and return to China. Contract was signed some 120 days before I stepped into the classroom again.
Henan Uni bought return flight Bj - EU, issued 3 x 1/2 salaries for 90 days Z-home-sit-on-my-ass .... ----> 'are you stupid? Me, too (being very pissed)!'... and demanded from School payment for all scratching-in-my-home-90 days. Return flights, too!
Of course, all my belongings stayed in Henan Campus apartment, and I returned home with carry-on luggage.
Lucky me, 'cause my mom is 'never-throw-anything-away' person, so I had some old winter clothes for the freezing North EU weather.
and, I am just an English teacher, who never thought about to becoming an astronaut and fly to the far-by planets from China ...
biggj123:
Holy fuck....man, I've never had problems like that. They make it so hard to work legally and so easy to work illegally. I guy with a tourist visa would have just got that job would have just had to jump to HK every 6 or months or whatever an not have to deal with any of that BS....seems that is the price you pay for peace of mind in china and not have to worry about getting caught working on the wrong visa.
icnif77:
You see now, why one must ask for 'laowai hire authorization', before inking the Contract.
Few months ago, I was looking for new RP sponsor and I got two pretty good offers, but none of the Schools could showed me their laowai-authorization. Both stopped replying to my emails, instead.
If I would grab any of the offers and arrived to the new city with valid RP (Release letter and FEC cancel cert.), exit to HK is next and get new Z sponsor, which might be easy for native English speaker, but it isn't that easy for NNES.
