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Posts: 548

Shifu

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Q: University Job...WHY????

I am curious as to why people work at universities in China? What is the draw to teach in them? The pay is usually far below what you can get teaching other places. Most other jobs offer free housing and sometimes free meals. Those of us in the public schools get the same vacations and holidays free. I work 20 hours a week with no office hours required. I think that is on par with a university schedule. So, the benefits are the same it seems. The pay is not equal. I really do not see the draw to a university.

I am not being sarcastic or loathing to university teachers. I have just never understood why people choose a university over other school options. Your insights would be welcomed. Thanks.

9 years 9 weeks ago in  Teaching & Learning - China

 
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Emperor

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Firstly, because I never have to deal with bureaucratic nonsense, personal conflicts, pay disputes, or visa problems. My employer treats me professionally, and deals with any problems I have. My apartment is spacious and reasonably modern.

 

Secondly, because my job is really, really good. I teach Western History and Western Thought (history of Western philosophy) to bright, attentive English majors. I value job satisfaction (along with all forms of satisfaction) higher than money.

 

nashboroguy:

No difference with my job and benefits. Sorry. No help to my question.

9 years 9 weeks ago
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tbh66:

Same, in agreement

9 years 9 weeks ago
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andyinshenyang:

... (Initial post was way too grumpy!)

9 years 9 weeks ago
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9 years 9 weeks ago
 
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Posts: 879

Emperor

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Firstly, because I never have to deal with bureaucratic nonsense, personal conflicts, pay disputes, or visa problems. My employer treats me professionally, and deals with any problems I have. My apartment is spacious and reasonably modern.

 

Secondly, because my job is really, really good. I teach Western History and Western Thought (history of Western philosophy) to bright, attentive English majors. I value job satisfaction (along with all forms of satisfaction) higher than money.

 

nashboroguy:

No difference with my job and benefits. Sorry. No help to my question.

9 years 9 weeks ago
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tbh66:

Same, in agreement

9 years 9 weeks ago
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andyinshenyang:

... (Initial post was way too grumpy!)

9 years 9 weeks ago
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9 years 9 weeks ago
 
Posts: 3256

Emperor

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I worked 3 years in a Chinese university, 1 year of post-doc, 2 years as a IT lecturer

* Post-doc funds can be really nice. 10K RMB /months with free accommodation in a city like Hefei goes a long way. I was very, very free in my research work, no questions asked.

* Efficient administration with no bullshit and imaginative interpretation of the work contract

* Between being lecturer in France and being lecturer in China, with the monthly expenses, I  end up with (much) more disposable income in China. If you are waiting for a position while trying to publish, China is not a bad bet. All that while quenching your thirst for adventures while you are young !

* it gives a stable income and free time for personal projects without safe returns : developing software, consulting, writing books, etc.

* Far less competitive than academia in Western world

nashboroguy:

OK. I can understand the benefit of that. I never thought about a researcher and lecturer. I was referring to ESL teachers at universities. A standard, every day teacher. Thank you for the insight.

9 years 9 weeks ago
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9 years 9 weeks ago
 
Posts: 887

Shifu

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Yes, as others said - free apartment! Mine is new, big enough for my me and my wife...and right on a BRT station. Not having to deal with landlords...and rent isn't exactly cheap in Xiamen. I teach mostly post-grads now, which means they are older and we can discuss some more serious topics...No office hours and other useless 'activities' (!). Most Uni work is less than 20 hours a week, usually around 14, so you don't have to work 5 days a week. I have 16 periods this term, next is only 10, so only 3 days a week. I have worked in a high school my first year in China...and wouldn't go back but hey, that's just me...

 

Oh I forgot - you can drink with your students! wink

nashboroguy:

I have free housing too with no landlord requirements. But, I can appreciate the fact that you can discuss more complex topics and provide more diverse lesson plans. I know that there is more to work than salary. I think I would get very very bored with only 10 hours of work a week. I love to teach and being in the classroom. Considering I am working half of what I would in my home country, I thought that was a great benefit. But, I spend another 10 hours a week preparing lesson plans and preparing for my classes. I enjoy doing it, so, it does not feel like work to me. Actually, I love teaching so much, I can not believe I am getting paid to do what i do. Ha ha.

9 years 9 weeks ago
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manasyt:

Good! Most Uni teachers work part time, so they get one more salary indecision

9 years 9 weeks ago
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9 years 9 weeks ago
 
Posts: 860

Shifu

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I don't understand it either. One of the few allures of teaching in china is that you can earn and save money. I suppose the advantage of university is you don't need to teach little brats. However with adults you need to prepare more. i know somebody working at harbin university who gets 5000rmb/month. How can you live off that? even in china. why would you want to? 

DrMonkey:

You can live ok of 5000 RMB/months, if you are frugal. It can be a good way to wait one or two year to be candidate for a position back home (better condition, far more competitive). Academia is quite the jungle ^^

9 years 9 weeks ago
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dokken:

i was offered a position lecturing in china. i didnt take it because i dont even have a Phd. Apparently you can be a lecturer without a Phd and years of postdoc experience in china. For teaching science i think that is crazy. its a real shame they don't value lecturers and research more. it could interfere with the pace of chinese progress

9 years 9 weeks ago
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DrMonkey:

Yup, in China and Vietnam, a master is enough to lecture students preparing ... for a master. And yes, it's a major WTF, I don't think you get the deep understanding of a topic required for proper teaching. Neither you have the field experience (tinkering on the bench, designing experiments, etc) to give tips and war stories to the students. But not in China, there it's fine. TIC...

9 years 9 weeks ago
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DrMonkey:

Double post

9 years 9 weeks ago
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nashboroguy:

I don't think a phd is required to be a lecturer. I have met too many college professors who have stayed in acedemia far too long that they have lost touch with the changes happening in the real world. I do agree that a person needs to have the battle scars of their profession to be a lecturer. So, if they have a masters degree and years of valued, skilled experience, I do not see anything wrong with that. Just because you wrote a thesis paper on some mundane topic for your doctorate, does not mean you are an expert in your field. Before I did my masters degree, I worked 7 years in the field of my degree. I would sit in class and just have to shake my head with many things these old farts of acedemia were spouting. They were teaching things that were relevant a decade before, but no longer valid.

9 years 9 weeks ago
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9 years 9 weeks ago
 
Posts: 548

Shifu

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I am thinking, from the early responses so far, the answer comes down to personal preferences and purpose for teaching. It really has nothing to do with salary, or even benefits. Personally, I enjoy teaching middle school and high school students. I have never taught university students. I might like that age group too. I have taught kindergarten and primary grades. I know from my personal experiences that I do not enjoy teaching those grades.

I look forward to more answers. Thank you to everyone who has replied so far. Your answers have really provided me with an insight I had not happened upon before.

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9 years 9 weeks ago
 
Posts: 126

Governor

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I don't understand it either.

'Hey Mike, how is life treating you in China?'

'Not bad Bob, I am earning a neat salary of 1000 USD per month which is less than the minimum wage in the US!!!! and can save $200 every month from that.'

'Awesome pension plan you have there Mike!'...

 

Come on people, for that little money you could go and work in Thailand instead. The air is not polluted, the Internet is only a little censored, and you have the awesome beach...

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9 years 8 weeks ago
 
Posts: 1300

Shifu

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I agree with you that doing the usual ESL shenanigans job at a university doesn't make much sense for the salary. Maybe many people do it for the visa security so they can take on the sketchy part time jobs or tutoring gigs on the side. University teachers have lots of free time after all. 

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9 years 8 weeks ago
 
Posts: 29

Governor

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Universities are great IMO. Why? 

 

1. Stable and safe - no scams or BS games

2. Low class hours - typically 8 hours a week

3. Free furnished apartment - no roomies!

4. Lots of campus students want TOEFL or IELTS tutoring

5. Plenty of free time

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9 years 5 weeks ago
 
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Answer of the DayMORE >>
A:  "... through ..."?  Only "through" comes to mind is "S
A: "... through ..."?  Only "through" comes to mind is "Shenzhen agent can connect you with an employer, who's authorized to hire waigouren ... and can sponsor Z visa." It's not like every 10th person you meet in Shenzhen's hood can sponsor work visa ...  The only way to change from student to labourer visa is just a regular way by: 1. Finding an employer, who'll apply for an Invitation letter; 2. Exit China and apply for Z visa in your home country's Chinese embassy; 3. Enter China in 30-days after Z visa was stamped into your travelling instrument ...As I am aware, you won't be able to switch to Working permit by remaining in China....,so make ready for a return to your home .... -- icnif77