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Q: Why are foreigners so envious of China's economic ascendance?
There is a great deal of nervous and negative chatter about China's economc ascendance in the Western press and even here on this site. As for the Western press, it often comes from those countries noticeably on the decline : the United States and Great Britain. German press, for example, tends to be much more balanced in their portrayal of things in China (because the German economy is on the rise) and the Brazilian press, for example, is also more balanced. Is it jealousy? Has the sun sunked on the Anglo-economic empires?
12 years 12 weeks ago in Business & Jobs - China
You've already made this point on sever other threads, including ones that you yourself created. However, I am curious. I read a couple Brazilian newspapers regularly, and I would like you to show me examples of Brazil being more fair and balanced towards China.
By the by, licenced media outlets are, by statute, heavily censored by a council appointed by the administration in the year proceeding any election.
O Globo and the Estado de Sao Paulo are exceptionally balanced in their points of view concerning China. Recently in fact, O Globo, which you may read, carried a front page article on the decline of the United States, and how years ago everything that America lectured South America about is now happening in ... America.
Die Welt and Spiegel also carry similar articles as does the Frankfurter Allgemeine. Amerika ist kaputt.
kchur:
Could you send me a link? How about Folha de São Paulo, Brazil's widely recognized newspaper of record. How does their slant on China and America balance with your own?
Shining_brow:
How does "Amerika ist kaput" equate to portrayal of Chinese economy?? And, even moreso, where does that possibly lead to 'envy' of it? Yeah, the US has issues, and they need some serious changes to fix things (don't like the chances, btw...), but sheesh... talk about lack of logic!
nevermind:
You'll just champion anything that agrees with your warped peception of China. China is a giant ponzi scheme. As well, China is in the exact same precarious situation as the US with the overextended debt in second and third tier stories as well as the unpaid debts and scams. You guys are in for a serious wake up. Remeber how cocky Dubai got until their house of cards fell? China is next.
Silly question, sorry. I don't think anyone's concerned about the idea of China being an economically viable/prosperous country.
Most concerns I've heard, and indeed hold, are related to the fact that the Chinese government regards SE/central Asia as its own personal plaything combined with concerns as regards internal human right issues, combined with the fact that China will happily do business with most unsavoury of regimes that even the pragmatic US won't work with.
Any (even remotely) sane person will see both huge opportunities and potential problems associated with the economic rise of China. To write those concerns off as mere envy is not useful.
If I had 1 apple 10 years ago and I accumulated another apple today, I suppose that is equal to a 100% increase in a 10 year span. If I want to spin the numbers I could tell you I have maintained a 10% growth yearly for ten years. Do you fear my growth?
HAHAHAHAHA!
God, you only exist out here because of US. Without us, YOU would still be starving in rice paddies and fighting each other. Now, you live in crappy, cheap apartments and barely make enough money to live. Meanwhile, back home, even the poorest of the poor are more wealthy than middle class China and have a better life.
We did what you are now just doing 200 years ago. Do you get that? You're 200 years behind.
Man, what a joke.
Just to jump on the bandwagon, and reiterate what MissA said...
Sure, the rest of the world would LOVE to get a big piece of China - a large population with an upwardly mobile disposable income, technologically advanced (ie, communications, infrastructure).
But, as she also said - while your country has the government it does, and doesn't allow for any change.. nor any criticisms against it, China will continue to get bad press... for the bad things that it does! As MrT pointed out in a different thread (thanks for the clarification there!!!), those islands in the Phillipines were a non-issue - until they found oil! T!bet was quite happily its own little country - until they found lots of minerals there. What's the bet there'll start to be border disputes up north as soon as some resource is found that they want?
Change your government, and change your policies, and sure, THEN you will see some serious envy... until then, just suck it up!
Is the west jealous of China's economic rise? Not really. Anyone who understands global economics knows the pattern China is experiencing right now.
The US did the same thing, so did Japan, UK, etc... in their past.
First you have a mostly agrarian society, then it develops into a society based on manufacturing, then a service based society, then a tech based, then....
However, the one thing that is common with each step in the cycle is that the society needs to have a bigger and bigger voice in the procedings in order to build a strong platform for the next step in the cycle.
For example, look at Russia. They are a good historic example of where China could be headed if they don't learn from the past.
You need to learn to look beyond what is spoon fed to you by the media. You need to look at the bigger picture if you want to see where things will most likely head.
Mostly, I don't comment on threads that I think are mindless drivel, flag waving, hate mongering or cultural suck ups.
If you love China, that is fine. But at least open your eyes and see the rest of the world and where it is going.
China's economic ascendance ?.
Come on, dude, be intelligent. What ascendance?
FACT : In China, if you are earning 12,000 Rmb per month, you are consider socially to be a "rich" person. 12,000 Rmb = $ 1,890 USD. In USA if you make $ 1890 per month, you are under the poverty line, and can receive government subsidies and join the food stamp program.
So, a "rich" chinese is equivalent to a USA "poor" man. Is that any type of ascendance ?.
What has happened in reality?. A few selected ones are getting richer each day, while the vast majority are getting poorer with inflation and fixed salaries that do not change in years. Capitalistic societies are no better and no worse than socialistic ones, same old crap in reality.
Do not allow government propaganda to brainwash you, use your mind to think, not to carry your hair ! 
You have shown me intelligence and wisdom previously, please use God's gift to you to make your own mind, do not allow others to tell you what to think, please.
Xpat.John:
Fact: The cost of living here is substantially lower than in the US. So what is considered poverty level in the US has no relevance here.
HappyExPat:
Xpat John: I am well aware of the cost of living bin USA and in China. I am not bringing the USA cost here, I am just saying that a rich ,man in China is equivalent to a poor man in USA. Is that a great economic society ?. I am not comparing them, just stating two facts, you draw your own conclusions.
Xpat.John:
So you are saying that a person in the US, who makes US$40,000, considered middle-class, would be poor if they were compared to the EU where they would be making roughly 30k. Rich is a relation of what you can buy in your home country compared to those around you. It isn't a relation to what your same income would buy in another country.
And to be honest, no one that I know of considers anyone making 12k per month rich. Middle class, maybe, but not rich. Unless they are living in a tier 3 city, that is.
xinyuren:
When the average Chinese person makes around 1K a month, 12K is considered wealthy, not rich. But in fact 12K will only buy you a cheap, second or 3rd rate lifestyle by western standards.
HappyExPat:
In the socio-econimic strata, the border line between middle class and rich class in China is an income of at least 12,000 Rmb per month. Anything above that, you are a member of the "rich" social class, without any influence if you feel rich or poor with that income.
nanabanana:
HappyExPat: To be able to analyse economic situations in reality requires knowledge. You should compare the real exchange rate between the two countries (namely the US and China) before making unintelligent comments that merely shows your jealousy about the growing Chinese economy. What the Chinese owns today is earned by themselves through years of revolution (or centries) by their true potential. They have never taken advantage of other countries like the west had.
HappyExPat:
Normally, when people do not have a sound argument to rebate a thought, they turn to personal insults. I will not bother to reply that, being a member of Mensa for many years is sufficient for me.
But I will challenge your brain cells (if possible) to think about China's economy growing in the two digit column for yes, and in 2011 slowed down to between 9 and 10 %, and this year is forecasted barely above 8 %.
And for your information, there are many laowais that enjoy being in China, and think about China like I do, but none more than me. But I am also fair, and as I can see the many positives, also see a few negatives once in a while. Just like it happened back in USA, nothing wrong with that,
No, China is not the evny of all foreigners. I think that a lot of foreigners think its good that China is growing and have better lives than they did before.
In another post I mentioned how dim-wits here always think everyone is out to get china. This question is along the same lines, though less whiny and more arrogant.
Come to think of it, this question is just the same as the propoganda on state media....good job, hope you get paid your well deserved wu mao.
The better question to ask would be "Why are so many idiots convinced the US is dying?"
Shining_brow:
Ummm - because your economists have been talking about how bad your economy is... and your presidents saying how they can fix it??? Just a guess...
Every country is bound to have its day in the sun. China's time will pass eventually and go to someone else. Right now it's looking like it'll be India or Indonesia. 981 seems to have been having some serious bouts of delusion lately.
All you are doing is trying to incite arguements and hatred. This site is not intended for that purpose, and therefore, you are off topic to the site.
Your behavior is instigator-ish, mundane and childish, and a bit pyschopathic. We invite you to grow up and stay relevant to the purpose of this site.
Thank you and have a nice day 
usa is so jealous of china the us govt hire people to post good things about america and bad things about china. american govt has such a napoleon complex. fragile ego becoz florida is so small (3 inches)
nevermind:
It's funny, China doesn't even realize that, outside its borders, no one gives a crap about it. Literally, you go back home and people don't even register this place. They don't care.
crimochina:
they seriously think people all over the world are learning chinese and getting ready to bow down to them. the only reason china makes headlines in the west is becoz of unfair trade practices, nonsense statement by leaders, trying to steal land/ water from their neighbors or seriously unfortunate situations / accidents that may occur. people dont understand that china is paying to set up language centers in small school districts. and ex- chinese nationals are leading the charge to shut them down
In truth, there are those in the West who fear China. Also in truth, those are the same ones without a clue. One of the motivations of me moving to China was to get firsthand witness of their economical rise. Now that I've been here a while, I find it interesting, but it is laughable to think that China's "rise" is anything more than the accountant's wizardry, smoke and mirrors.
Anyone who has any fear, really just doesn't know the facts. This is not a denigration of China as a nation, just the truth. As someone already said, anyone can make a 100% growth statement (look, mom! this year, I made 2 dollars instead of 1!) but the real story is in the streets of every day China. When I walk the streets of China, I don't see an economic superpower.
MissA:
Great answer. I came here with similar expectations, and am rapidly reaching a similar conclusion.
I agree with Xinyuren. There is huge gap between china and the west.
As much china is an old country with rich traditions, i dont see the sence in their trying to compare themselves to USA in everything.
What is the sence?
These are 2 defferent countries with defferent types of governance,The chinese should be able to stop their trying to compare themselves to Americans because america is light years ahead of china.
As much china is an old country with rich traditions, i dont see the sence in their trying to compare themselves to USA in everything.
What is the sence?
These are 2 defferent countries with defferent types of governance,The chinese should be able to stop their trying to compare themselves to Americans because america is light years ahead of china.
China is not in a economic boom, it's in an economic recession hide a way that is driven by the hiding of funds and loses that only India can see. If you control the media in your own country, you control what the public see's. China is of now, hiding every fact, fudging numbers across the board, no one knows if China has money, or is it all just digital BS.
Agree with MissA and Shining Brow above, but would also add China gets much of it's "bad press" from it's piracy and selling of unsafe products. Also, the fact that all of a sudden those islands are an issue, which never were an issue before. China is in the midst of its own bubble in many sectors and many companies are already leaving due to unfair business practices, corruption, costs of labor and more. Don't worry, the construction boom, which is the primary driver of China's growth can't and won't last.
I don't see any envy. I only see foreigners coming here to make a few bucks just like they have done in UAE, Singapore, HK, and everywhere else in the world. China is not unique in this aspect.
LMAO!!!!! Ha ha Ha ha!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I don't think so!!!!!!!!
Have a good one!
LAR is right. The better question is...Why would anyone ask such a silly question in the first place?
We aren't, but I sure am a little envious of the ruling class here, past and present. They're the ones who escape with several hundreds of billions of dollars to emigrate to the west and live a life of luxury forever.
Meanwhile, China continues to crash and burn. Whatever so-called economic boom is going on, will quickly prove to be a massive recession once the fog of war lifts. Almost 20,000 officials have fled China, taking countless billions (perhaps even trillions) with them. This country will crash and burn in the near future.
China's debt alone will be it's undoing, along with the lies it tells about it's economic indicators.
As example, Wikipedia reports China's official "debt to GDP" figures as totalling about 60%
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_public_debt
But a report a few days ago says that the real 2012 figure has jumped to 155%. That is incredibly high for an undeveloped economy, and the report says that figure doesn't reflect the hidden debts - bond issues and underground lending. The real figure is likely to be much higher.
http://blogs.ft.com/beyond-brics/2013/03/18/china-debt-heading-for-a-fall/#axzz2P5wwnUjF
LAR:
"The............higher." Damn Traveler, is that right? I keep up on my business-related reading,stay abreast of new and ongoing business trends,etc..but simply didn't know that
China's debt problem was that dire. :( Jeeeeeeeeezzzzz!
Traveler:
I read many conflicting figures. It seems that nobody really knows what the real economic situation is, least of all the government. However, I would be more inclined to believe non-government sources.
I marvel at how China reports increases of exports to many countries, but those same countries report decreases of imports from China :-)
LAR:
Thanks Traveler. "However,............sources." I agree. To what do you attribute countries decreasing their imports from China? Price,poor quality,logistics,etc?
Traveler:
I think it is a combination of all those factors, but the overriding factor is that China is too difficult to do business with. China's overriding compulsion to punish the entire world for it's own past mistakes is alienating it from the world it is 100% dependent on.
China's previous markets are rapidly turning to other sources that are easier to deal with, and that have at least some business ethics.
