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Q: Why do so many Chinese work over 60 hours a week?
It seems like every young person I meet in China who is working at a fitness center, restaurant, bar or department store is working 12 hours everyday with one day off a week.They literally never have any free time and usually live together with the other employees of the business. But, usually when I walk into one of these stores (outside of peak hours) I see people sitting around doing absolutely nothing.
Most people working full time make about 3,000rmb a month in my city and get free housing or live with other employees. Average rent in my city is around 1,000-1,500 a month. I feel like people could easily afford to work only 40 hours a week if they lived with a friend. I guess most business don't offer less hours? Thinking about this actually really upsets me. What does everyone think?
Why are so many businesses running fully staffed around the clock?* If there is time for employees to play on their cell phone, take a nap, or play cards then why pay them to be at work? Let them go home.
*hiring someone to continuously shout about an item that is on sale on a loudspeaker
*hiring one to mop and two to fan the wet floor with a piece of cardboard
*hiring five people to continuously wait for the five customers that might come outside of peak hours (this is at every clothing store I've been to)
Water melon story. A story on typical Chinese Boss-Employee Relationship. (or Emperor-Underlings Relationship, historically)
One day a boss told an employee to go buy a water melon. He gave him the following instructions, "Go out of the door, turn left, see bridge, cross bridge, buy water melon there".
The guy went out, turned left, saw no bridge, came back. He knew there was a store selling water melons had he turned right.
Boss barked angrily, "you moron, there also is a water melon store on the right!"
But what went on inside the boss's mind was, "Here is a good employee I can keep. He is obedient".
Had the employee turned right and came back with a water melon, the boss would say, "Job well done! An employee like you is hard to find".
But what went on in his mind would be, "Must find an excuse to fire that smartass asap. This guy will steal all my customers one day". (Chinese emperors think in these terms, 'execute' and 'rebel')
Cunning, Hypocrisy, Face, Deceit. 'Great' working relationships. 'Great' harmony.
Karma101:
Haha Fingernailed IT...
This happed today morning... I walked into factory, everyday we have these 5-20 mins morning meetings, and everyone lineup to do this. shout out things like vision and mission statement and so on followed by updates(if any). It's a daily 5-10 mins routine.
So today, like everyday people lined up but the leader was late. And now comes the awkwardness, nobody in the group of around 20 had any idea what to do and looking at each others faces completely dumbfounded... I was standing in the corner and watching. Even after 5 minutes nobody moved, STILL waiting for the leader. Finally I couldn't watch anymore and left (if I could speak Chinese it was easy to just lead the chorus). I don't know what happened after.
It feels like people are trained to obey, not to take any initiative.
earthizen:
Wow, what synchronicity 
They ARE trained to obey. Bo Yang's book The Ugly Chinaman ended with this sentence, "When a beautiful phoenix flies over Chinese's head they shoot it down". A less poetic expression is "the nail that stands out gets the hammer".
You taught them something priceless, how to think and act as a fearless individual. They all knew the drill but no one stepped up, thinking 1). that would offend the leader who has stronger guanxi upstairs (that's how s/he got to be a leader), not good. 2). 100% certain that it would create jealousy among peers, unwise to make so many enemies with a stupid chore. 3). How much do I get paid for this? Nothing. You think I am a moron?
All part of water melon philosophy, hahaha.
It may have to do something with people have no idea what to do when they are not at work... In the company I work for, people sit around 13-14 hours daily, even if they have nothing to do. and the Boss seems to like it.
I've been telling my colleagues, spend more with family and on your health... but no! they want to stay at work pretend to look busy all the time.
It was specially hilarious when company decided to have mandatory weekend holiday instead of 6 days working.. The question on everybody's face was now, wtf to do on Saturdays? 
earthizen:
You nailed the key reasons.
And you are lucky. Some bosses would hold a grudge against someone like you because of that. They can't say anything because you are right and to disagree with you is face losing, so they wait for their vendetta.
This is not a secret. A strategy of communist China (CCP), it is based on a key guerilla warfare strategy, when the enemy is strong (which is the case most of the time) hold your grudge and retreat, wait for a better opportunity. It is in their school textbook and that's how the zombies are trained. The adults even have an unofficial name for it, settle old scores when Autumn comes, which is nothing strange from the mouth of peasants (Autumn being harvest season, meaning you are well fed). Practically all China Mainlanders know about it.
Look at how long they wait for their revenge in the case of Japan. Not only did they hide in the drainage for decades, they invited Japanese MNCs to "invest" in PRC. For decades you never hear say a thing against Japan. Nowadays they are sending battleships straight through the straits of Japan. Harvest time, vendetta season.
Fake gold is forever fake gold.
Karma101:
yeah, I don't really care... won't be here that long! What irks me is... If I am using my time to hit the gym and staying in Shape. these very same busy people would get jealous of the attention I get and then just say you are fat... 
morget:
I guess this is what happens when you move from a highly individualistic society (U.S.A.) to a highly collectivistic society. Whenever I face a problem I don't understand I always first ask, "Why?" ,but I've been asking why since I've arrived in China and I haven't been able to answer it yet.
earthizen:
Karma101, you nailed it, jealousy. You do know the territory my friend. You graduated with flying colors. Thumbs up.
earthizen:
Morget, I agree, zombies vs individuals. Wise too, of the 5Ws (who, where, when, what, why), WHY is the most important imho. Way to go my friend.
I guess one positive thing about the chinese labor market is that they aren't big on part-timers yet. Most young people who have jobs, redundant as they may be, seem to be unemployed on traditional full-time employment contracts.
So even though they don't really make anything, at least they have some stability.
Every day I thank god I'm not a wage slave back home working 2 part time 24 hrs a week so neither of them has to pay benefits.
Im sure china is going to go that way, but for the moment hasnt yet
morget:
Yes, but back home there are many more opportunities and a bigger variety of choices than in China.
I suppose stability is a matter of personal preference, because I know I would never want to waste my youth working over 60 hours a week with 1 day off a week, which seems to be the norm around here.That alludes that there aren't many choices outside of 60 hour work weeks in China. I feel so bad for all of the young people I meet wasting away.
Ever tried to go shopping on a national holiday? There are people everywhere, you can't move and it's hell on earth.
60 hour work weeks are to keep the masses from all congregating in one area and causing chaos.
They might spend 60 hours at their place of work but not productive hours........sleeping, playing on phones, chatting....
Seems a lot of it is plain job creation for the sake of it.
morget:
Do you find that people are happy with this scenario? They don't want to have a life outside of work?
I am speculating that it's because everyone works like this so they see it as normal?
Are there regulations mandating that companies require their full time employees to work these hours? I can't see how one person working 60 hours a week will be as productive as two people working 30 hours a week.
Hotwater:
There are actually regulations now that say people shouldn't work those hours. But Chinese companies ignore these laws.
When I used to work in a big factory the poorly paid production operators wanted to work these hours as they got paid more. The office staff rarely worked more than their contracted 5 days/40 hours per week. When I asked the guys what they planned to do over the weekend most of the answers were watch TV and sleep!
morget:
The lack of enforcement is another thing that confuses me about China. You would think a communist country would be big on enforcement of the rules, but rather it's this complicated network on relationships and harmonious society bullshit.
Hotwater:
Referring back to the factory I used to work.....when the government changed the law a few years ago to limit the maximum overtime workers could do this foreign owned company complied with the new regulations & cut overtime work. They then lost a lot of production workers to local Chinese owned factories as they wanted the extra overtime to save more money to send home!
morget:
It's really uninspiring to me. When I worked back in the USA, instead of asking for overtime I would think of other things I could do to make extra money outside of work. That's how you create. If you are always at work at your factory how do you ever have time to hone your skills to ever aspire to more than a simple factory worker?
Karma101:
Yes, so true hotwater... It seems like many operators leave the factory citing lack of OT hours, and join a company whichever offeres the highest acceptable hours. Its understandable though... more ot more money, but then they miss out on important point that if they use the extra time in learning a new skill or maybe studying further. In future it will better chance of scoring a job which don't need 100s of ot hours....
you have to accept that there is a difference between "working 60 hours" and "being at work 60 hours". Productivity in China is low compared to e.g. my home nation. Where people don't do shit for most of the day, but when they do, they do it efficiently.
earthizen:
Nailed it.
A Non-Mainland Chinese (can't remember if he was from Taiwan or Hong Kong) said these three things about Mainland China, twenty six years ago.
1. A civilization without civilized people.
2. Have time, lack efficiency.
3. Have labor, lack talents.
morget:
It's a management problem. I don't think people are just being lazy, but rather there isn't any work to do, in which case management should have them go home.
In addition, I think most companies provide incentives in the form of commissions and we all know that Chinese people love money to spend on meaningless things (i.e. "keeping up with the Jones").
It just seems really confusing to me to see stores with virtually no customers for hours require three people to be working.
earthizen:
You are right. It can be a legacy from state owned enterprises which are the only enterprises in communist china. The state is responsible for arranging work for the people, so whether you like it or not that's it. No independent judiciary in such a setup (to be fair, even before communism hits china it has been that way for thousands of year, the emperor says you live, you live, the emperors says you dance like a monkey, you don't dance like a bird or else....). So, guanxi and bribery are the short cuts to 'successful living'. Their country, their boss, **shrug**, their responsibility.
Scandinavian:
@morget
You are right that with correct carrot swinging in front of their heads, most people will do a better job, so management solves a lot of issues. But don't neglect the impact of Chinese parenting. A friend of mine works with a small team of locals. His boss believe in hurling man power at problems, but my friend believe in distributing the tasks among his team members to best use their talents. Efficiency in his team is through the roof compared to his peers.
Water melon story. A story on typical Chinese Boss-Employee Relationship. (or Emperor-Underlings Relationship, historically)
One day a boss told an employee to go buy a water melon. He gave him the following instructions, "Go out of the door, turn left, see bridge, cross bridge, buy water melon there".
The guy went out, turned left, saw no bridge, came back. He knew there was a store selling water melons had he turned right.
Boss barked angrily, "you moron, there also is a water melon store on the right!"
But what went on inside the boss's mind was, "Here is a good employee I can keep. He is obedient".
Had the employee turned right and came back with a water melon, the boss would say, "Job well done! An employee like you is hard to find".
But what went on in his mind would be, "Must find an excuse to fire that smartass asap. This guy will steal all my customers one day". (Chinese emperors think in these terms, 'execute' and 'rebel')
Cunning, Hypocrisy, Face, Deceit. 'Great' working relationships. 'Great' harmony.
Karma101:
Haha Fingernailed IT...
This happed today morning... I walked into factory, everyday we have these 5-20 mins morning meetings, and everyone lineup to do this. shout out things like vision and mission statement and so on followed by updates(if any). It's a daily 5-10 mins routine.
So today, like everyday people lined up but the leader was late. And now comes the awkwardness, nobody in the group of around 20 had any idea what to do and looking at each others faces completely dumbfounded... I was standing in the corner and watching. Even after 5 minutes nobody moved, STILL waiting for the leader. Finally I couldn't watch anymore and left (if I could speak Chinese it was easy to just lead the chorus). I don't know what happened after.
It feels like people are trained to obey, not to take any initiative.
earthizen:
Wow, what synchronicity
They ARE trained to obey. Bo Yang's book The Ugly Chinaman ended with this sentence, "When a beautiful phoenix flies over Chinese's head they shoot it down". A less poetic expression is "the nail that stands out gets the hammer".
You taught them something priceless, how to think and act as a fearless individual. They all knew the drill but no one stepped up, thinking 1). that would offend the leader who has stronger guanxi upstairs (that's how s/he got to be a leader), not good. 2). 100% certain that it would create jealousy among peers, unwise to make so many enemies with a stupid chore. 3). How much do I get paid for this? Nothing. You think I am a moron?
All part of water melon philosophy, hahaha.
