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Q: Hiring teachers with different titles but have them work as English teachers
So many schools hire non natives as textbook editors, managers etc... ( in other words a non teaching visa ). But, they acrtually work as English teachers. It's very common. Doesn't China know about it? and why didn't it stop issuing such visas since most foreigners work as teachers in a KG or TC.
If I want to report such things, is it to the PSB or bureau of foreign affairs?
2 years 24 weeks ago in Visa & Legalities - China
Why would you want to report this?
Are you being impacted in any way?
Here is where minding your own business is probably the best plan.
If an adult wants to work in China and accepts the risks that this involves without doing their own due diligence, it is their responsibility, not yours.
All I would do is advise a person against accepting such a visa and acquaint themselves with the pitfalls of accepting a visa under false pretences.
If someone choses to do so, it is their (choice) as an adult.
and none of your business (or mine). You seem to have a thing about reporting foreign workers who may or may not be working illegally.
Maybe turn your attention to the employers who are trying to dupe people into working illegally.
energyking73:
don't be angry brother! I am not reporting them. I am just asking. Thank you.
sorrel:
angry ?
"brother" ????
i am not the one who is asking about ratting out foreigen workers and following a theme - your FIRST 'question' :
https://answers.echinacities.com/question/can-someone-report-school-me
icnif77:
How do you/can you know for which job your Working permit is?
All documents are in Chinese and must be submitted by Chinese employer, so who ever knew what was my profession ... listed and applied for.
Let me report, now!
You must be a reporter ... 
Stiggs:
@ Icnif that was my first thought too, OP comes across as a shite stirrer to me.
icnif77:
Ridiculous Q and replies of OP ...
At my start in China, employer (Helen Group Hangzhou) got me working with F visa, which I didn't mind at that time. Had a contract and all ... Then employer started to disrespect signed contract and I dialled SAFEA as my first time.
I complained to FEB with all the facts as "Yes, I am working with F visa, but employer managed that .." and SAFEA went straight after the employer.
Not a single thing happened to me. I didn't even get bad record, i.e. I secured next Working permit and Z visa with ease ... on suggestion of SAFEA's agent, who got me into the contact with the new employer ... in different province.
... I wrote here about my first pitch to SAFEA ... around 2010 or so.
Stiggs:
Yeah I strongly suspect OP is making up fairy tales to get attention and as Sorrel pointed out ( good catch Sorrel by the way) it's not his first time.
Why would you want to report this?
Are you being impacted in any way?
Here is where minding your own business is probably the best plan.
If an adult wants to work in China and accepts the risks that this involves without doing their own due diligence, it is their responsibility, not yours.
All I would do is advise a person against accepting such a visa and acquaint themselves with the pitfalls of accepting a visa under false pretences.
If someone choses to do so, it is their (choice) as an adult.
and none of your business (or mine). You seem to have a thing about reporting foreign workers who may or may not be working illegally.
Maybe turn your attention to the employers who are trying to dupe people into working illegally.
energyking73:
don't be angry brother! I am not reporting them. I am just asking. Thank you.
sorrel:
angry ?
"brother" ????
i am not the one who is asking about ratting out foreigen workers and following a theme - your FIRST 'question' :
https://answers.echinacities.com/question/can-someone-report-school-me
icnif77:
How do you/can you know for which job your Working permit is?
All documents are in Chinese and must be submitted by Chinese employer, so who ever knew what was my profession ... listed and applied for.
Let me report, now!
You must be a reporter ...
Stiggs:
@ Icnif that was my first thought too, OP comes across as a shite stirrer to me.
icnif77:
Ridiculous Q and replies of OP ...
At my start in China, employer (Helen Group Hangzhou) got me working with F visa, which I didn't mind at that time. Had a contract and all ... Then employer started to disrespect signed contract and I dialled SAFEA as my first time.
I complained to FEB with all the facts as "Yes, I am working with F visa, but employer managed that .." and SAFEA went straight after the employer.
Not a single thing happened to me. I didn't even get bad record, i.e. I secured next Working permit and Z visa with ease ... on suggestion of SAFEA's agent, who got me into the contact with the new employer ... in different province.
... I wrote here about my first pitch to SAFEA ... around 2010 or so.
Stiggs:
Yeah I strongly suspect OP is making up fairy tales to get attention and as Sorrel pointed out ( good catch Sorrel by the way) it's not his first time.
Sorrel has already put it very clearly: ratting others is quite the nasty part of the so called justice you seek. Advise rather than ratting others.
I, personally consider it creative that people find their way around the restrictions imposed in China to keep their business afloat. Children need and love to learn more. If a teacher needs to go this way so he can eat, I am glad he can do it. Let him do it.
Don't hurry to take his dish of rice off his table because he doesn't earn it by the today's rules. He is working and is worthy to earn his daily bowl of rice. Would you rather be happy to see a techer coming to you r rescuing for a piece of bread or would you send him to find a job? Is a job easy to find today, anyway? Then, why would you care how one earns his money? Don't be envious, will you? Let others be and look at the bright side of this: people won't give up on finding ways to decide their lives by and for themselves no matter how governments around the world may come in their way to make them stumble poor and dependable on the power that be. You should be happy that people are this creative. I, personally, am.
found this old thread on the same theme which I suggest you read through.
https://answers.echinacities.com/question/how-report-illegal-workers-teachers-0?page=1
Robk - on the second page of the answers makes a good point.
In China informing on/ratting out other foreigners will most likely back-fire on the person who does it.
But if you need to do this sort of thing to feel good about yourself, by all means go ahead.
But don;t expect any thanks from anyone.
Informants are usually despised by all - those who you inform against and those who you inform to.
It's very common? How do you know? Are you inspecting every non-native English teacher's work permit card and interrogating them on their job titles?
Unless someone is taking money from your pocket, food from your plate, or causing you extra work, then the specifics of their job title vs their job.... None. Of. Your. Concern.
Life is hard enough, let them be.
And FTR, every non-native teacher that I've met in the past three years was either a certified subject teacher teaching their subject or received their degree in a NES country. It IS possible for NNE people to legally teach.
sorrel:
careful now !
there has been an exponential increase in WOKE virtue-signallers in the last 18 months.
sorrel:
@octavo
Cheers !
I prove my point. From what I see the WOKE tend to be 'holier than thou' taking on a 'cause' which does not impact them at all without thinking of the fall-out this will result in. A bit like the OP wanting to report possibly illegal workers. 
icnif77:
OP is replying with more than one handle ... 
@ cocktavo:
"... tangently dump on an important societal issue ..."
Just 'cause Chinese society is such a high integrity civilization ... we westerners are all aware of dat ...
Chinese only important issue always has been "better screw you than me ...".
That is all it is in China, of course under the veil of "prevention of losing the face" retardedness!
sorrel:
@octavo
does your resorting to personal abuse and name calling mean that you have no logical or rational response or comment to make?
If you have a point to make, please keep it civil.
My point that the WOKE seem to have a tendency to take on 'crusades' without regard to consequences or fall-out is (IMO) exemplified by the OP's desire to inform on supposedly illegal workers.
Not a very compassionate thing to do (as many of the WOKE I encounter claim to be 'compassionate') in a country where the same person is also a foreign worker. I find the WOKE act not out of being personally impacted by their 'cause' but to give their otherwise bland lives a purpose, but there is also a large element of 'virtue signalling'. I can not think of any reason why a foreign worker would want to inform on other foreign workers - shades of the WOKE Stasi more than anything else.
Adults are capable of making their own decisions when it comes to possibly working illegally, as they are also responsible for the consequences of their actions.
I don't feel the need to be personally abusive to other posters on this forum, and a bit of friendly advice - keep it civil
sorrel:
@octavo,
thanks for the name-calling again. Great response.
And a coherent comment also helps in understanding any point you want to make.
I know you can do this as your answers/comments have been both coherent and relatively civil up to now.
Am I going to be one of the few on this site favoured with personal insults?
please let me know if i have not kept it civil - I don't recall targeting any specific poster for such charming attention such as you are honouring me with.
Are you not able to engage in online discussion without abuse?
or is this how you treat anyone with whom you disagree?
I find that often 'brave' posters find refuge in online abuse that they would not have the courage to resort to in a face to face discussion, whereas I can have as discussion such as this (in person) no problem and not have to fling made-up epithets around.
I maintain that looking for and reporting potentially illegal workers is not the business of any foreign worker unless their own job is being impacted OR the worker is harming students, as per Nashboroguy's comment below.
Not a compassionate or human way to behave, and one that certainly disregards possible consequences of those impacted.
Sadly 'virtue signalling' and f**k the consequences are a more popular way to behave.
sorrel:
@Admin,
I would ask that octavo's comments be left in and not censored - I see they have been removed.
His comments were hardly that offensive, and personal attacks such as they were say more of the person that posted them than the intended recipient.
Octavo, why don't you just go nuts and 'down-vote' all my comments? Might make you feel better if you can't actually punch my face !
@EnergyKing: In your response to Sorrel you said, "I am not reporting them. I am just asking". Yet, in your original question, you said... "If I want to report such things, is it to the PSB or bureau of foreign affairs?". It may be splitting hairs, but why would you "Question" such a thing unless you anticipated on using the information.
I agree with all the other postings here. Mind your own business. Unless you are being damaged by such actions, or you know of a foreigner harming the students in some manner, just let it be.
Remember that we are guests in this country. We are not in any position to question the laws and policies of our host nation. We may disagree with such things, it is their country to sort through. The only real option is that if one can not handle such differences, we can always leave our host country. The natives are pretty much stuck with it.
come on; energyking wants to see if he can find out what foreigners are doing and we are falling for the bait
I know a few teachers that have degrees in subjects not related to English but taught it.
The PSB don't check the certificates, as far as I know.
I don't have a degree but worked for 15 years teaching English. The PSB didn't ask to see my certificates. I had a TEFL and many yrs of working in education settings before coming to China.
icnif77:
You are only required to present BA degree completed in native English country, doesn't matter in what subject for an English teaching Z visa/Working permit.
It's safe to say, anybody without mentioned degree works illegally in China women&men, i.e. not with the proper Z visa.
