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Q: Admin suggestion: Troll feeding and reaction
Hi guys( and girls)
( as i said that i just noticed we mostly have guys around here other than for the two infamous members, and thanks Phil for reminding me about this, i’ve been way too busy with designs/marketing recently and forgot to post those)
Anyway, Here is the suggestion and reaction to what has been seen in the last two to three weeks, so let's start by some explanations:
- Posts and questions HAVE been deleted/edited, however after this we( namely I) received some whining from members for their deleted posts, so deletions is not as easy or straightforward as some of you might want but there is a reason for that.
Namely the “troll feeding”, most of the users complaining about the bad behaviors of some members actually participate in the spread of that behavior by posting commenting.
So suggestion number one:
Stop troll feeding. Also should you want this question to be deleted, add a little “ok for deletion” in the end of your comment/answer. ( it should not be the only thing written in it)
Also to note Uniqlo has received her third warning ( editing a question after it was answered and profanity (who knew!) ) and as such will be temp banned.
Suggestion number two:
Some people have been complaining about the behaviors of others and the , seemingly ( but not actual), lack of response to it.
However a number of those complaints were directed to answers/comments that were borderline and not a clear cut violation. In addition to that the users complaining often attacked the users they were complaining about on those same threads. So in the end should a harsh stance be chosen, BOTH types of users should be dealt with.
( some of you will answer that those attacks would not happen if the first user was dealt with; One it still doesn't allow you to attack others, two there needs to be warnings before actions can be taken, the attacks started too early for any such action to have an effect)
So here is the suggestion ( actually more of a forewarning with possibility of protestation, on this post only, should you feel it necessary .); harsher stance from admins/mods with more deletions/editions of posts. Also due to the observed “borderline” or gray zone of many questions/answers/comments, eChinacities reserves the right, for kitty cat only though, to add a “Kitty cat did not find this appropriate” rule to allow deleting and editing of posts with warnings in case of repetition.
Have a good day everyone
Kitty cat
Admin i suggest you to make the rules clear in here.
I feel the forum is more like an emotional trash bin for those who have difficulties to manage their own emotions to flood shit in here.
Why do you think it is ok for viki to sell uniqlo's pic in here?
By saying that, banning a person or 2 will not really make much difference.
Yes you can ban uniqlo and viki, but soon, there will be uniqlo2.0 and viki2.0 back to forum.
I'm thinking if it's better if one must register with phone number or wechat...
Then when someone violate the rules, you mute their speech rights from 10 mins till a week...
That way, you'll build the conditioned reflex in them.
You train them to behave.
What do you think?
:
Kitty says bad, bad Uniqlo wearing 2.0 cape, Kitty can see you. Kitty scratches Uniqlo2.0-> Critical, uniqlo2.0 dies of hepatitis B. ( user deletion, no warnings)
philbravery:
sit ....siiittt....good boy...now roll over and play dead the more you bitch the more they do it .....i know it works for me
Translation please anybody
adminanswer:
summary: if you answer/comment it becomes hard to delete/edit for us
So 1) if you are ok with your answers/comment being deleted because you don't like the question/answer , put " ok for deletion" at it's end.
2) a lot of users ask for a harsher stance, that would also be the case for their own answers/comments too.
3) Kitty cat will now add a new rule for deletion/edition : "Kitty cat did not find this appropriate", to allow for the harsher stance that would not allow all those borderline profanity/spam/attacks.
This will concern all users, including those who complained but actually participated in borderline rules breaking. And if you don't like trolls don't feed them.
Have a good day.
Admin is right with the troll feeding. They keep posting because they keep getting a lot of responses.
If people here have a problem with trolls, then it's up to us to stop feeding them. The fact that they are being fed, and fed well at that, maybe suggests that enough of the people here are amused enough by them to encourage them to hang around.
This website reminds me of a few bars and restaurants I've been a regular at. When I started going they were great.. just my atmosphere but over time you find that the clientele changes, the atmosphere changes and it's just not the same anymore. Where before you'd be enjoying a beer and listening to classic rock in the background now you're having to yell at each other to heard over the techno music.
It's not necessarily a bad thing for the bar, it's just that the old regulars start going somewhere else and new regulars appear and now it's just a different scene.
I feel like that's happening here at ECC. There are the people who tolerate trolls where before maybe the troll would have been run off.
Having said that one has been a regular for quite some time now and the reactions to her have always been the same so..... maybe there was always that element who doesn't mind a bit of troll baiting.
This could be the new clientele, the trolls and troll baiters.
Here is a thought; ban multiple-account holders.
ironman510:
Yep and can easily be trace by their IP, even VPNs no matter which email they use.
iWolf:
Actually it is not as straightforward as one would think. The problem lies in the fact that chinese ISPs like most of those in the world use Dynamic ip addresses. To even secure a static address in china is an exercise in extreme hoop jumping. Been there done that. So tracing can be done but it wouldn't be just a simple router search and ping job ......in a practical sense hunting someone suspected of having 2 accounts on ecc is a fool's errand and a waste of time.
Admin, this is not really related to trolls, but anyway....
It has been talked about before, how people are leaving the answers section and not been replaced, or not as fast as they leave.
Trying to fix the troll situation to improve the answer section is all well and good ( and probably futile) but really it's not addressing the root of the problem. Members who leave aren't being replaced and I don't think trolls are the real reason why..
Can I suggest revamping the front page? I know this has been said before but I think it would make a huge difference. As it is now, when people visit the front page there is just no reason to explore the rest of the site, and presumably get interested in the answers discussions.
I don't really see what the fuss is about or even fully understand what is meant by the term 'troll' other than a fictional being in stories for children. Just a person who wants to mess with others it seems. Anyone who would do this consistently is either deeply immature or mentally unbalanced, so reacting aggressively to such a person rather than ignoring them, is either insensitive or downright childish. I say ignore the poor bastards and get on with the conversations that interest you.
ironman510:
The fuss is we had a lot of good people come here with real questions and gave good respectable answers without insulting them. (check out shenzhenstuff.com) that's what this site is slowly turning into. It's sad. It was going good for awhile.
mArtiAn:
Well that's the internet, isn't it? I prefer a site that has the odd ridiculous character on it like Uniqlo to one that over controls its user base.
cub:
martian, there comes a time where a free for all anything goes too far unchecked at another persons expense and its not a pleasant site to try to ask a simple question and get a simple real answer without being ganged up on and attacked called names insulted and leaving the site
mArtiAn:
Only person I've noticed anyone ganging up on is Vicki, and she doesn't seem to mind. I thought Uniqlo was the problem anyway. Well she's just one person, can't do much ganging up by herself
The Man in the High Castle? Is that what this Echina site is becoming? Who can we trust?
Hotwater:
But what do you want? Free for all bullshit links SZStuff or a well moderated site?
yeah, where did all the decent china related questions/answers go? not the sex loaded junk thats been posted with profanity only Whats sad is that when trolls are allowed to roam free by ECC to try to keep the site alive
nzteacher80:
I agree with you cub. Yes, I know, it feels weird for me too.
Shame on you Kitty. Shame shame shame.
This jack booted moderation style you propose makes Heinrich Himmler look like an open minded pacifist.
I get it, you are trying to keep everyone happy. The problem with that is that when you try to please everyone you end up pleasing no one.
The squeaky wheel gets the oil knee jerk reaction to ban, warn , crackdown on whatever the site's whining bitches have a jones about this week is short sighted, illadvised, narrowminded and destined to do the opposite of what you intend.
As almost all expat forums go through their ups and downs, this method is often seen as the solution. The fact is, the forum part of an expat website comprises a tiny part of the revenue and has only a few dozen users but uses a lot of resources and time.
Honestly, if vicki or uniqulo or whoever wants to post shit. Who cares? As crap as their posts are and i mostly ignore them, they are still more interesting than some of the other tripe. For fuck's sake people, grow up. Ignore what you don't like. Stop being butt hurt bitches. Live and let live. Post whatever the fuck you like and don't give a shit.
The whining bitch brown shirts will howl this down. And of course my cowardly stalker will downvote me with all of his accounts. And do i care. No, i do not. This is a forum filled with adults who can choose what they read but instead they choose to and make an effort to be offended. Fucking whining spoilsport dicks.
And i guess i will get a triple warning for saying "fuck". Or banned when some wanker whinges about profanity. Look where we have ended up. Fuuuuuccccckkkk!
cub:
come on wolf seriously, does all your profanity make u feel better? Really does it help the situation any? prfanity is half the isue here on this site that required a mod or censored posts. Before the last change it was getting very ugly and uninformative with the question that a member posted getting lost in all the bickering and attacks by being jumped all over
iWolf:
Firstly there is no profanity in my answer unless you are a 16th century quaker. Secondly, if you don't like the way i write, don't read my comments. Simple. Just as i choose not to read comments from some users for various reasons. Fun Fact: did you know that the word FUCK has been in the dictionary since about 1470. And the first recorded written use was by an anonymous Christian monk was who reading through the monastery copy of De Officiis (a guide to moral conduct) when he felt compelled to express his anger at his abbot. “O d fuckin Abbot,” he scrawled in the margin of the text
philbravery:
its funny how the biggest whiner hasn't been posting . Maybe China did us all a favor and Banned them?
cub:
seriously wolf calm down, And i dont care if john the baptist merriam webster themselves invented your usless worthless 4 letter word. Does this word back in 1470 mean the same definition as u are using it? Its YOUR use of these words and attitude are why u were warned and comments along with your sewer language. Rules are rules And rules are there and are hopefully enforced for a reason wolf. If u dont like following the rules or any rules ie boundaries then suffer the consequences and get deleted and banned off ECC ok? i will be happy to help And i care less if u been on ECC for 50 years
iWolf:
Yes cub, I am using this word in accordance with the dictionary.
And no I haven't been on here for 50 years.
Do feel free to downvote me, report me, whine to Hello Kitty, whatever but whether you personally agree with my vernacular or not, you should support my right to be free to use it. Or did we all become nazis and want to crush freedom of expression?
I, personally, don't like or agree with many of your comments. Some I do agree with. BUT I do support your right to say them and express any and all ideas you wish to post in whatever way you wish.
cub:
wolf, no rules and no following rules lead to anarchy and chaios So do u want this here on ECC where everyone is attacking fighting each other while the chinese and ECC staff are laughing at us? go ahead break the rules make up your own rules in a supposedly civilized society see the consequences that follow Seriously u think i care to down vote u? U are self reporting yourself to Admin by your posts they read wolf, congrats So if u get warned or banned thats your doing Again this is supposed to be a china related answer and question forum not a popularity contest
iWolf:
In a 1906 biography called The Friends of Voltaire. English writer Beatrice Evelyn Hall published the book under a pseudonym, S. G. Tallentyre, and intended for the line to be a reflection of Voltaire’s attitude towards Claude Adrien Helvétius, another French philosopher but whoever said it, it is relevant.
Stiggs:
I'm from the same school of thought as Wolf. If you can't be bothered with what people post - and who could blame you - just move on and ignore the thread. Getting upset by idiots on the internet is just stupid.
I do understand people not joining a website if it's over run with dickheads though.
Most of the people on this website are wankers anyway. Just ban em all.
nzteacher80:
"Kitty did not find this appropriate." Kitty expresses the fact that Ted does not like Tim or wants him on the seat next to him on the ECC bus.
nzteacher80:
Wanker is not a swear word? Okay. Tim you are a wanker and you wank yourself red raw every day you wanker.
Another easy fix: add a "block" function to our user abilities. This way, if I don't want to read bullshit questions/answers from someone, I can just put them on my blocked list and never have to see anything that they type.
cub:
if we had this feature spider, there wouldnt be anyone that wouldnt ask or answer questions just a lot of blocking each other and nothing getting done on this site Thats when silence isnt golden
Spiderboenz:
There would be 3-4 people and 6-7 accounts that get blocked. All trolls who don't actually contribute anything productive.
cub:
but how would u know this? Do u have some insider info to be sure?
SpongeBob:
This is a public forum, not your personal fb page. How can you block someone if you can't add them in the first place?
It's not like anyone can just post anything on here as their personal emotional trash bin.
Everybody should know this is a q and a section, so unless it is a real question, they really shouldn't post it on here.
Admin i suggest you to make the rules clear in here.
I feel the forum is more like an emotional trash bin for those who have difficulties to manage their own emotions to flood shit in here.
Why do you think it is ok for viki to sell uniqlo's pic in here?
By saying that, banning a person or 2 will not really make much difference.
Yes you can ban uniqlo and viki, but soon, there will be uniqlo2.0 and viki2.0 back to forum.
I'm thinking if it's better if one must register with phone number or wechat...
Then when someone violate the rules, you mute their speech rights from 10 mins till a week...
That way, you'll build the conditioned reflex in them.
You train them to behave.
What do you think?
:
Kitty says bad, bad Uniqlo wearing 2.0 cape, Kitty can see you. Kitty scratches Uniqlo2.0-> Critical, uniqlo2.0 dies of hepatitis B. ( user deletion, no warnings)
philbravery:
sit ....siiittt....good boy...now roll over and play dead the more you bitch the more they do it .....i know it works for me
I think the polarization of opinions comes down to the popular press. You are left or right, and never the twain shall meet. This drives people towards personal social media, where they can choose their friends, and not have to deal with alternate opinions.
This is a shame, but it is a natural progression.
Clinton's camp has admitted they pay for "social media consultants". I think the figure was 6 million bucks. So what is the point of having a good fight on a public forum if you know you are up against paid people?
I am not taking about ECC here. I am talking about the major news networks, and the major social networks. Public forums should be a place for a good bit of banter, a place to share ideas, and have a bloody good debate.
But now it is just left and right.
There was a bit of a battle between left and right here, the right won. They done everything they could to win, they won, and now they complain there are not enough posters.
Go figure.
I remember when 20 or 30 upvotes was the norm. Now, when I log in, all I see is 4 or 5 upvotes for right wing ideas, and all left wing opinions downvoted to hidden.
The right wing won. They gained control of ECC. The right wing has censored the left. Their bully boy tactics took all the fun out of posting.
Well done to the right wing. You won. You gained control.
Now it's up to you to fix what you broke.
Shining_brow:
Firstly, I find it amusing to notice that you have 2 blue votes, and 2 red votes :p
Secondly, no Scots, the right didn't win!!! (well, not on here). We let them think they won by not bothering to reply to their inane ideas.
I think you're right with one idea... they tend to say that no-one should be censored... and they, as you said, they downvote you to oblivion! (granted, the liberals would say the same thing - everyone has the right to free speech... so, I'm not sure where I sit - cos I don't believe in unfettered free speech! There's a time and place for it all, and sometimes speech needs to reserved to particular times and places!)
AS for media and all.... my mate back home (German) showed me a German video on youtube about various 'independent' media sources and the people who run them... and just how closely they are connected to various institutions and political organisations - the ones they are supposed to be commenting on (criticising). Nothing unusual about that... unfortunately :(
