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Posts: 1142

Shifu

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Q: Are the student protest in HK different this time?

-What do you think? Are we going to see a real response from the Party? Are they going to go home in a week? Will there be a bloody Sunday?

-I'm expecting something, but not a full blown square dance this time...maybe a few broken arms or bloody noses with some tear gas...

9 years 27 weeks ago in  General  - China

 
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Posts: 19790

Emperor

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I could just get article on Huff Post. Everything else is blocked on Yahoo-gle:

 

In Beijing, more than 60 Hong Kong tycoons, including Li Ka-shing, Asia's richest person, met with President Xi Jinping. It's only the second time such a big delegation has visited Beijing since the 1997 handover. In 2003, a similar entourage made the trip after a huge protest against unpopular legislation.

The tycoons urged democracy activists to avoid a confrontation, saying Beijing won't change its mind.

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9 years 27 weeks ago
 
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Why can't they handle the possibility of a Chief Executive who doesn't like them? Pretty much every country they deal with doesn't like or respect them because they're a class of parasites, most of whom are only in the party because of their nepo-connections.

icnif77:

How is any other country different than that?

'..because they're a class of parasites, most of whom are only in the party because of their nepo-connections'

9 years 27 weeks ago
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DrMonkey:

Ok, so let me pick the candidates for you, and don't see any evil : I'm the good guy. And I've a big stick anyway. Whatever you say won't matter anyway, go to work and STFU. That will work for ya ?

9 years 27 weeks ago
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icnif77:

I don't agree with Mainland on the matter, as I replied once to Samsara's post, buTT…comment from CBS:China as a civilization existed much longer than the USA.

They do not need us to lecture them on how to rule themselves, neither do they need our incompatible systems there.

Could we not learn that our "democratic" system has been rejected throughout the Middle-East?

Just forget the idea that somehow we will overthrow the Chinese and Russian governments - because their response to such attempts will be of such that our western civilization will NOT withstand it!

9 years 27 weeks ago
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DrMonkey:

@icnif77 Saying China is a continuous authority over millennia is ignorance at best. They had a lot of disruptions between periods of firm power, each time on fairly different territories. China as we know it was born in 1949, with figments going back to 1911, Sun Yat Sen revolution.

 

Or, if we use the same argument of loose historical continuity, then USA's history merge with Europe's history, it started as Europe 2.0 after all. On that basis, they can claim a few thousands of history too.

9 years 27 weeks ago
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laowaigentleman:

@icnif. My country (New Zealand) isn't like that. Australia isn't really either. Nor are Denmark, Norway and Holland.

 

There are seven political parties in New Zealand and it would seem the only member of any of those who has any lineage is a Labour MP named Stuart Nash, whose grandfather was the former Prime Minister Walter Nash.

 

Stuart campaigned in many electorates in the north island over the last ten years and has only just managed to win an electorate seat in the recent election. This was a safe Labour party seat which would have voted for a monkey draped in a red flag. Virtually no-one in New Zealand is impressed by him because of what his grandfather did. His grandfather wasn't that great anyway, but the older generation were brainwashed by their parents into voting for Labour to chase away the Tories. Now Labour are a bunch of academic kooks.

 

NZ doesn't have primaries either, so you don't have to worry about the "I knew his grandaddy" which is such a big factor in the south of the United States.

 

I hate dynasties. They're so... feudalistic.

9 years 27 weeks ago
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icnif77:

We're 'pissing against the wind' hereangel.

I'm in Kaifeng, where Super carry butter, buTT...it's US butter, more white than yellowish color, what means it's probably mixed with margarine. I ate butter last time a year ago, but it was NZ, yellowish butter. I want MORE NZ butter!

9 years 27 weeks ago
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9 years 27 weeks ago
 
Posts: 3256

Emperor

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What I think => They should really stick to pacific demonstration and disobedience, with a *great* discipline, because one single broken beer bottle will be used as a pretext to discredit them. I'm pretty sure that the argument "they just do this to avoid studying" will pop-out soon, if it has not already.

 

What kind of answer to except => Medias won't speak about it much, or only under the angles of troubles encouraged by vague "foreign interests with an agenda" and lazy students. I don't think there will be a lot of broken noses and bruised faces. Beijing won't move at all : face, fear of domino effect, confidence of having the upper hand.

 

Civil disobedience and persistence to express their grief *every day* in visible yet pacific, humoristic ways is the best way. No mass demonstration, but every damn day make your voice heard, even it takes 2 years. Don't give any exposed surface to be named the bad guy, and play Beijing at its own game.

Almost:

Although I agree 100% with your comments, I fear that Xi might choose the Putin solution and simply arrest the most wealthy and influential Hong Kong biz men and bankers to show how he can throw wrenches into the gearbox of HK's money machine, even at the risk of economic suiicide.

 

As much as Shanghai tries to emulate and copy HK in a vain effort to become China's financial engine, investors will never trust the manipulations of Shanghai's stock market.

 

Imposing its will upon the most freedom-loving Chinese in the world could be the beginning of the end of the CCP dynasty if the protesters remain peaceful and resolute as Dr. Monkey explained quite well. 

 

As for the "face" issue, I actually believe that works in favor of HK not BJ since China needs to demonstrate to the world that they honor their agreements in business and in politics since they have invested over a trillion dollars outside of China in FDI and JVs. If they have to lose any face at all, the lesser embarrassment would be at home with a local and not on the international stage where they stand to lose all the respect and admiration they have acquired since 1978.  It would be much like America's blunder to invade Iraq based on a pyramid of lies, or the Snowden or Manning fiascos.  We lost all of our international credibility and alienated long-standing allies just for the stupid and selfish way Uncle Sam chose to resolve those problems. I think the whole world, especially China learned a PR lesson from those mistakes as well as T Square.

 

This HK matter and Beijing's choice of resolution will be a pivotal point in China's history as was Midway or Gettysburg or 911 in America's.  It will be interesting for sure.

9 years 26 weeks ago
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9 years 27 weeks ago
 
Posts: 2587

Emperor

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The Partywill not change it's mind.  It's a matter of face, it's a matter of foreign and domestic policy, and most importantly it's a matter of survival.  They just can't.

sam239:

Wasn't someone claiming that keeping HK distinct is crucial to the greater mainland's success? If they turn it into just another Chinese city - which is what HK people seem to fear the most - they've killed off one of the greatest assets the country has. And the pooping in the streets is symbolic of how the mainland will treat HK. Evil

9 years 27 weeks ago
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xinyuren:

I agree.  But HK isn't Chinese communism/socialism.  And that is their point.  If HK becomes a thriving democratic zone, it would mean a quicker demise for the CCP. This is why they were so high on promoting Shanghai's free trade zone. They want a viable replacement for HK.

9 years 27 weeks ago
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9 years 27 weeks ago
 
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