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Q: Do expats living here consider China to be an enemy?

I just had a rather rude person accuse me of being a "traitor" and a "wumao" because in the past I provided professional English, public speaking, and labor relations training to the officers at the PLA  military academy and/or because I made favorable comments about some aspects of China life. 

 

Many of us marry into the Chinese culture and many more of us teach their children and now I must ask you directly if you consider China to be an enemy?  If so, then why the hell are you here?  Would that not be the epitome of hypocrsy?

Come on now, how do you really see China in the world today?  Have you already forgot they bailed us out of financial disaster in 2008 bu buying $2 Trillion of U.S. debts?

 

China will never embrace our western political ideology but does that make them an "enemy"?  Forget about being politically correct because our identities are shielded by user names. What are your honest feelings?

9 years 47 weeks ago in  General  - China

 
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Comments (13)
Posts: 879

Emperor

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Why is living in China whilst acknowledging problems with its government hypocritical?

 

1. I have a good lifestyle here.

 

2. The CCP is horrible, dark and corrupt.

 

I'm totally clear about both those facts.

 

Do you think people should accept and support a country's political ideology (in this case one of censorship, suppression and indoctrination) if they want to live there? Why?

 

Have you considered that the Communist government is only one aspect of China? What aspects of China am I allowed to be critical of? None of them? Other aspects but not the government?

 

Please clarify what opinions you think we should be allowed to express.

JacobJohn:

"Please clarify what opinions you think we should be allowed to express"

 

I subscribe to the same question. 

9 years 47 weeks ago
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9 years 47 weeks ago
 
Posts: 2878

Shifu

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Thats a Gumby of a question notime2lose!! Love what youre doing..keep it up! Smile

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9 years 47 weeks ago
 
Posts: 7178

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I don't see anyone as the enemy.

 

I have FB friends all over the world. Some of whom would be classed as enemies by some people.

 

The way you use the word "enemy" is more an indicator that you have been exposed to military indoctrination.  If you stop and look at your question from the outside, can you see the slight possibility that you have been indoctrinated?

 

We have all been brainwashed to some extent.  I was brainwashed into thinking Great Britain was the best country in the world, and that every non British citizen wanted a UK passport and access to the UK welfare system.  I have been proven wrong about that. 

 

Yeah, some of the posts on here could be construed as anti "where we are". But it's not often said seriously. This is a place to share knowledge, experiences, and sometimes vent off a little steam.

 

 

 

 

 

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9 years 47 weeks ago
 
Posts: 691

Shifu

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I don't think of China as an enemy and Thanks Gosh I am not an American.....

 

I would love to be called as ,'Wumao' instead of 'Zelda'. I would love to be called 'suppressed' instead of having blood stains on my 'gloves'. I would love if my comments are down voted as I am not looking for a 'badge of General Aladin Al Waddiya' on my shoulder rather would prefer retire as a 'Brave soldier'.

 

 

 

 

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9 years 47 weeks ago
 
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The only enemy China has is the leaders. The people and the gubbermint are two different things. I certainly do not hold any enemy feelings towards the Chinese people. 

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9 years 47 weeks ago
 
Posts: 1263

Shifu

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I consider you an enemy. Commie.

 

 

 

(just kidding)

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9 years 47 weeks ago
 
Posts: 369

Governor

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Only somebody who thinks such thing, can ask such question. Are you looking for approval? 

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9 years 47 weeks ago
 
Posts: 58

Governor

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I honestly do consider the Communist party as the enemy. But I don't consider China or Chinese people as enemies as such

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9 years 47 weeks ago
 
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I feel the opposite. I dont feel the government is my enemy at all. Other than facebook or youtube they havent effected my life one bit. In fact, i know im gonna be called a wumao but id think my history here would prove otherwise, but i think the government does a pretty good job, minus the local government officials with little man syndrome. Bit i just dont see how anyone else would do better leading a country full of mindless morons.

My enemy is the chinese population at large. 70% are dumber than dogs and this effects my life greatly every day. Makes me really feel sorry for the 30% that have brains. I despise them and they are truly my daily enemy.

Is it hypocritical that i stay? Perhaps. But as someone from vancouver with currently over a million chinese draining our fiscal and natural resources, i feel i have the right to stay and knock up hot chicks and make too much money. When those million come back ill gladly screw off.

ambivalentmace:

my sentiments exactly, everyday the 70 percent are the warzone i constantly observe and watch for some crazy of the handle problem and try to maintain sanity.

9 years 47 weeks ago
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Shining_brow:

"My enemy is the chinese population at large. 70% are dumber than dogs and this effects my life greatly every day"

 

How much of that is because of the government?

9 years 47 weeks ago
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mike695ca:

@shining. In my opinion none of it is because of the government. People are too quick to blame the government and a lack od education for beibg a piece of shit. But you dont need a degree to know that walking in traffic is dumb. You dont need a degree to know that pissing and shitting in public is wrong. Yet they do. The government doesnt make people stare at me all day. Fuck cavemen didnt have any form of government yet i can guarentee you that more chinese light themselves on fire than cavemen ever did. There is a big difference between knowledge and intelligence.

9 years 47 weeks ago
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expatlife26:

As usual I tend to agree with Mike on this one. There are lots of really smart, capable, decent people here, it's just that I don't think the average foreigner really gets much exposure to them. They just see the people at the bottom/lower middle and buy into the idea that people at the top are the real problem having never met them. People who work in big companies or government in developed areas here seem to be almost as likely (read: about 40% let not kid ourselves) to be somewhat talented as in the west.

 

The smart people who are doing well are easily on the same level as the smart people anywhere...be it the US, UK, Japan etc. I've spent some time in the HK office of my firm and honestly it's not like night/day; the HK staff being 100% stylish geniuses compared to the bumpkins pooping on the floor in Shanghai. The difference is at the bottom, not the top. HK is only more livable because the average person there isn't a selfish, rude jerk .

 

I think that because the wealth gap here is so big, you don't get too many people who voluntarily work beneath their ability earnings-wise. Like someone who has/can get a good engineering job but just doesn't like it and prefers working with their hands. I know a few people back home like that...smart but just not suited for office work. But then in the west it's the difference between a BMW and a Ford...not a BMW and a push cart.

 

Private education isn't exactly the most prestigious/highest paying field out there so if that's the world you live in as a foreigner here (where you interact only with street vendors, students, rental agents, language teachers & useless EFL management staff) you might get the impression that everyone here is a damned fool and that's just not true. If a local person is really good at things...they don't work in EFL, they work in whatever industry has the prestige/pay to match their talent/connections. There aren't enough genuinely smart, capable people to go around in industries seen as lower paying/less prestigious so the ones who exist congregate in the top fields (to help cover for the connections hires!) 

9 years 47 weeks ago
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9 years 47 weeks ago
 
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Wow, freaking wow, we do have some characters on here.

I actually like most of the people encounter here (well maybe a minority of overall ppl but a majority of people I encounter closely because I drown the rest out like chirping birds), bus and taxi drivers and such tend to be friendly, if not warm. But then there are more than a handful who I might think of "amoral slimeball" and certainly not friends.

But yeah on a broader scale I think that certain PTB here are an enemy (may the Goddess prevail), but not the country or the people, and don't see that helping them out is clearly traitorous. If someone takes it and does something bad with it, it is their responsibility. I myself have thought of similar questions but am a little nervous about posting it.

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9 years 47 weeks ago
 
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It's really clear now that you're either a lying Chinese, a traitorous westerner, or a spy.

 

Let's examine your posts, shall we?

"But getting back to the OP, I have provided some training to the PLA officers in the past and having served in the U.S. military myself,"

 

"I served in the U.S. military. Did you? I worked in federal service for five years - did you? "

 

"Am I trash because I provided English training and public speaking, and labor relations training to officers of the PLA? "

 

Yes, you are. You're trying to back out of being revealed as a wumao by saying you only taught English and public speaking. That's bullshit. I get the feeling that you've done a lot more than that.

 

Anyone who's been in the U.S. military knows that China is a threat to the United States, and to world stability. Anyone who has been in the "federal service" knows that China is a threat to the U.S. They are constantly hacking us; our infrastructure, our government, etc. And they're making off with classified stuff. And the U.S. government is full of colossal fuckwits who can't stop a bunch of retards from downloading 12 TB of files.

 

If you really are an American, you're either a traitor, a troll, or a spy.

Shining_brow:

Ever  noticed the number of wumaoren who claim to have done military service in the US army? Almost like it's a pre-requisite.

9 years 47 weeks ago
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9 years 47 weeks ago
 
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No, I don't see China as being my enemy.  Instead I see China as being my meal ticket.  Admittedly offering only a simple meal...one with shitloads of oil, salt and MSG.  And no real substance, but, nevertheless, a meal.

But what I do see in China is a fantastic example of a 'bellicose goat'.

 

 

 

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9 years 47 weeks ago
 
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The government and the people aren't as clearly separate as I first thought. It's more of a "Chicken and the egg" situation. The people created this government, and the CCP bears the traits of the vices of its people. Static hierarchies, pretence, greed, bullying, no social responsibility, cruelty toward the weak. The people and the government share these traits in abundance.

The worst of all, is the rigid thinking:
Rude arrogance or complete submission.
Success or complete failure.
Expectations entirely met or not adhered to.
Perfect flawless harmony or violent revolt.
Friend or ENEMY. Nothing in between.

Am I your enemy? If you think that way, I'm proud to call myself your enemy.

9 years 47 weeks ago
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9 years 47 weeks ago
 
Posts: 124

Governor

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China isn't your enemy , but also isn't your friend. About the government we all know its all about self interest, as for the people's hatred or resentment for foreigner. Every country/region have that right ? Its just common people's nature, they are uncomfortable with different or foreign things.

coineineagh:

china is culture-starved and will remain so as long as xenophobia and national myths prevail. this goes for both cultural exchange, as well as societal development.

9 years 47 weeks ago
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9 years 47 weeks ago
 
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Follow expats...wumao's propping up China and bashing the US and the west is not the problem.

 

The real problem is when a well spoken one baits us to fish for information and politically sensitive opinions, and we happily oblige with detail.

 

Heavily indoctrinated minds will never bend so argument and reasoning is futile.

 

Informed rational opinion based on truth and facts is a foreign concept to cult followers.

 

 

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9 years 47 weeks ago
 
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Nooooo, Of course not, China has never pulled the trigger first.

and to be honest I don't want China to embrace the western style, it doesn't work like it use to. Look what Obama is doing now. I'm an American, an IT, 500 people a day line for jobs that I could do in the U.S, but in China people line up to hire us for jobs. So the system will never be fix that fast, America needs a new style to embrace.

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9 years 47 weeks ago
 
Posts: 250

Governor

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I think we should use use history to evaluate, judge, and answer this question...,

 

1) China has been "introverted" politically for over 5,000 years

2) Only twice have they sent through troops abroad and then recalled them within weeks

3) China can barely maintain it own population historically

4) China has never built or operated a military base overseas

5) China has never shown any expansionist plans

6) Internationally, Chairman Mao was all bark and no bite. He's been dead for 38 years.

7) Despite modernizing it's military, China knows it lacks the technology to win a war with the West.

8) China and the West have grown into symbiotic economic partners since 1978

 

Given the above facts, and lacking any real issue of dispute except a handful of islands, China is not likely to provoke any war with the West.

 

For those that may argue that China is building up their military, it is justified considering that America military forces keep expanding in the Pacific region with troops in Japan, Korea, Diego Garcia, The Philippines and a new naval base being built in Australia, with probably another coming soon to Vietnam.

 

Imagine if the Chinese built military bases in The Bahamas, Bermuda, Mexico, and Canada. Americans would freak out and build up their military as well.

 

So despite our daily bashing and trashing of "life in China", I personally don't see China wanting to be anyone's enemy, and unless they are provoked, the only war they will fight will be the one now underway for the last five years - the economic war.

Burak43:

I am more concerned about the CCP using their economic might to suppress freedom of speech as well as stealing technology than any military engagement with the west.

9 years 41 weeks ago
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DrMonkey:

1) The famous 5000 years... Why 5000 years ? Before the Shang dynasty, 3000 years old, there are no definite trace of a coherent state with cities and administration.

2) Chinese Navy is still being active chasing Somalian pirates, it's a major trade road for them. They started that around... Was it 2008 or 2010 ? Also, the war with Vietnam in 1979 lasted for more than 2 weeks, with troops within Vietnam.

 

5) No expansionist plans. Did you look at the shape of the claim in the South China Sea ?

As for the "no provocation"... The Chinese army is playing hide and seek with the Indian army at the border, painting rocks on the other side "LOL it's ours". Sudan is filled of Chinese weapons, that you find in the hand of the Seleka fighters in Central Africa. I guess you live under a rock and didn't heard of an oil rig with 80 navy boats moved into a disputed area.

9 years 41 weeks ago
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9 years 41 weeks ago
 
Posts: 117

Governor

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China tries real hard not to be anyone's enemy and I give them a big gold star for that.  I think China in the top ten least-provocative countries along with Denmark, Norway, Canada, etc.

DrMonkey:

China, least provocative... I guess you lived in the jungle for a while, Tarzan. At the Indian border, there are regular Chinese incursions. At the Vietnam border, after the major (failed) Chinese incursion of 1979, there have been several serious border fights in the 80's and 90's. And of course, you have the ongoing island comedy. Bringing an oil rig with 80 navy boats within a disputed zone, totally not provocative. Creating flight zone over a disputed zone without any discussion, totally not provocative. 

9 years 41 weeks ago
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Tarzan:

They have been having border disputes for centuries and they probably will never end, so their actions can technically be called defensive.  They don't make a habit of invading countries or fabricating some crisis to justify a war.  If they were truly provocative they would surround Japan with warships instead of those tiny islands in the South China sea.  Asserting your sovereignty in your own regional backyard is not being provocative unless shots are fired and people die.  I think you know what I mean. In comparison, Russia and America have traditionally and historically been provocative to advance some agenda (usually oil).  Just keep your eye on Central Asia and Khazaktan and you will see what I mean within a year or two.

9 years 41 weeks ago
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DrMonkey:

I don't call this "defensive action", and I won't lump China with Norway or Canada based on this
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sino-Vietnamese_War
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sino-Vietnamese_conflicts_1979%E2%80%9390

9 years 41 weeks ago
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9 years 41 weeks ago
 
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I don't think so, I like China, well at least I like it when locals are not trying to scam me or don't tell me to "get the f* out" when they see me hand in hand with a Chinese woman, or when they are not staring at me while swearing in my face as if I was not understanding Putonghua then quickly switch to some sort of local dialect when they realize that I DO understand. TBH the Chinese government don't bother me at all, it's some of the locals who are a nuisance, they can't mind their own businesses and go on with they lives, they need to stare at foreigners, to spy on foreigners, to gossip about foreigners, the only place in China where I didn't experience such behaviors and where people have been friendly to me without inviting themselves in my privacy is Guangdong.

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9 years 41 weeks ago
 
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