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Q: ESL recruiters...the worst expats?
I realize that I talk, let's say some shit about ESL, but I want to make it clear that my point is that I don't think it is wise to be an ESL teacher. Not that I think it is wrong in any kind of moral way. It was wrong for me because I hated it, but my objective complaint is that it's an ok job that just doesn't scale as you get older. And that’s it. Really.
Expat recruiters on the other hand can be real bona-fide pieces of shit. I just read that “Request for Visa/ Legal Help - Teaching Scam” post; taking it at face value it sounds like that John Pate reminds me of a guy I met in a Shanghai pub about 6 months ago (though it’s not him, this guys name was Mike); this fat British sack of shit about 30 years of age who has a similar business in south china where he brought in UK teachers to fill positions out in China’s hinterland for a cut of their pay. Let me tell you he had nothing but contempt for the people he brought in. This guys laughing it up telling strangers at a pub how much he makes off putting these guys in dumb situations, and also had a deal with an insurance company to sell them overpriced health insurance.
I may not admire the career choice of ESL, but they’re mostly decent people same as anyone…this guy wasn’t. This guy was obviously a former teacher who had an inferiority complex about it and no qualms about screwing people after leading them to trust him because of shared upbringing/nationality…just rationalizing it thinking that he’s not stopping them from performing their due diligence, but if someone is going to make money off bad china decisions it’s going to be him
That is not the right way to get out of ESL, that is going native in the most despicable way possible.
The only other expat line of work that I think comes close were these guys I met working for a shady visa/law advisory (NOT A LAW FIRM) company. I’m pretty sure that was Chinese owned, just had a couple saps working for them. Basically they would just do shit for you that you could do on your own at a fraction of the price like getting visa extensions or charge you an arm and a leg for business incorporation services etc. They’d advertise all over those 2nd rate Shanghai Stuff-type websites a few years ago…really they only existed to part suckers with their money. Trick some poor sap who is in over his head into using them to incorporate their soon-to-be-failed trade company.
I knew a guy who worked there for a couple months as his first non-esl job and just left in disgust. I don’t think those types of jobs are mean-spirited though…like with that shithead recruiter laughing about the crappy cities he sends people who trusted him to. That’s more just pathetic. “Am I really willing to prostitute myself to give legitimacy to a charlatan? Well, at least it’s something other than ESL on my resume.”
I dunno, anybody encounter anything sketchier they have expats doing?
9 years 48 weeks ago in Business & Jobs - China
"overpriced health insurance" I thought only I was cheated in that way
Baivab:
No No...I met someone in a Bar and he told me about an insurance..Since I was new at that time and he was living here for 6 years, I thought he might be right and just trying to help me.Ended up paying 8000 for some crapy insurance :(
Wow, that's indeed low, very low. Middle-men at the worst...
The worse expat I ever met so far is not on the same level. It was a guy trying to date his successive Mandarin teachers, only to change teacher when he go rejected. Way to discourage vocations and build a reputation...
In my understanding, Chinese rarely see anything wrong with the whole concept of sugarcoating useless services one could do himself to make money. That's the whole principle of 中介 or intermediary that takes a whole new dimension here. And of course the density of unfathomable and obscure rules and laws and institutions just make it such a fertile ground for those.
I used to know of universities that sold study abroad packages to their students at absurd prices, claiming they had partnerships with universities throughout the world, where the actual service they delivered was merely a regular application process, with nothing special, which costs nothing if one does it by himself. And they earned like 3K per head like that, and it's business as usual as long as people are happy.
Or just like that spammer the other day, that was allegedly confusing his own "visa service" website with an official institution. Business as usual as well. I'm sure the guy sincerely saw nothing wrong with what he was doing.
So, yeah, I can understand how a fraction of people would get into this very lucrative business. Especially since no one seems to have any morale issue with it.
I do think the worst expats are those working for big corporations, who have wife and kids at home and a young Chinese girl in an apartment in China.
expatlife26:
No but they are respectable because they make good money; they have that coming to them. The difference is these recruiters are supposed to be poor people but they are cheating. they should know their place.
expatlife26:
Well in all seriousness, I think the recruiter thing is worse because it is done in such a callous mean spirited way. Having an affair is absolutely pretty low but really just boils down to selfishness.
Its not intentionally causing harm for your own benefit even though in the end that is exactly what happens in many cases.
Close call...
Scandinavian:
an affair is not only selfishness, it is also lack of respect for the people who will end up getting hurt. The recruiters are also selfish and lacks respect for those people they deal with. The difference is that you can actually say no to a recruiter, the spouse and children back home have no say in their life being f'ed up.
mike695ca:
Gonna have to agree with @scan. Thats pretty low.
Im not so big in the Shenzhen expat scene as I live too far away. But on weekends sometimes I go down to the largest expat area for a pint and dinner. ( Seaworld).
Lots of foreigner whole families there. Anyways, recently I was having a pint and got to chatting with some older chinese dude. Aparently hes this filthy rich land developer in Seaworld. And we were talking about all of the construction, and he mentioned that pretty much the whole development industry in the area is to cater to super rich guys in large companies that have a hidden family here. They usually work in HK or SZ and come over to spend some time with their mistress. He said this mistress industry is almost completly funding the development, that the local population has been tapped out.
I had no idea it was that bad.
expatlife26:
@mike I've heard that too about the 2nd family in the mainland.
I dunno why people have to be so irresponsible. Don't get married to someone you aren't interested in being faithful to. And for god's sakes if you do...wrap it up!
Scandinavian:
@mike those are the HK business men, that is a well known fact that Shenzhen is housing a huge number of "women of the night" whose sole purpose is to sit and look pretty until the business man goes on a business trip.
Zhuhai actually have the same. Some of the residential communities, the one I live in included, are rumored to be 10% of these women. And there is a trend of women dressed up for fun, being picked up and dropped off by cars in the above average price range. A guy I know in the next building has a single woman living in the apartment next to his. This is a 2-3million rmb apartment. She has no job, spends all the time at home with her dog except sometimes carries home department store bags, and every thursday at 22, there is the same dude showing up.
Robk:
Having a mistress is the norm here in China for wealthy men.
A lot of Chinese females actually KNOW about this and pretend to deny it or are actually proud that their man attracts all kinds of women but SHE is the WIFE.
It is messed up, I know... But generally most women expect it and will condone it as long as it doesn't blow up and humiliate them. It's one of those subjects only Chinese men will discuss and Chinese women joke about.
expatlife26:
@rob I have the same impression.
An affair isn't bad on it's own, it's just embarrassing if he gets caught publicly. It's not the betrayal of trust that's the issue it's the shame of unwanted attention.
I think it might be because of divorce laws favoring the wealthier party. A woman can't claim infidelity and get half the assets, so it's just sort of an implicit "You get to live an enviable lifestyle, I get to sleep around"
The only Chinese woman i've observed freaking out about cheating was a wealthy woman who married a man of lesser means. She would watch this guy like a fucking hawk and I wonder if that was sort of like "You aren't sleeping around on MY money you broke bastard"
like the issue again wasn't breach of trust, it was that he didn't know his place.
expatlife26:
yeah but Almost, that's not real that's just a post you made on another forum. I think the old guy in the picture is Wilford Brimley, an old cowboy actor and reported diabetes-haver.
expatlife26:
I mean I know you're not talking to anyone here, just working your search engine optimization, but still anybody can link to something they posted themselves.
why don't you link to something real? like those awful recruiters who shaved curse words into innocent teacher's heads...i mean that's something that EVERYBODY needs to know about.
http://answers.echinacities.com/question/recruiter-scam-alert-have-you-been-victim
Expat Financial "Advisors". The sort who mis-sold Endowments and PPI in the UK over the years. Came over here to teach ESL then got jobs selling over-priced Investment policies for companies line Austen Morris, Deveres, etc......lots of promises and only vague comments about how much the fees are.
expatlife26:
Yeah I know the type. I actually looked into that when I was trying to get out of teaching... it was the only resume I sent out to a non teaching job that got back right away.
They don't pay a salary and expect you to put in time for them while investing nothing in you. If you are good at it you can make a lot of money but there are better sales jobs out there; business to business sales is always much better than business to consumer so anyone decent would work in that.
Your highness please allow a low ESL teacher to comment.
You refer to only 2 recruiters(1 of which is quite possibly made up, no proof). And 1 drunk in a bar. So that means most Expat-recruiters are scammers?
expatlife26:
I don't think you're low, in fact the first paragraph is me saying you're probably a good guy like anybody else.
my point is that expats that take advantage of their foreigness to gain the trust of and scam other foreingers are low.
Not everybody has to do that...but I think it's kind of a shady industry
I have to thumb this question down because you're grouping all expat recruiters together.
I used to be a recruiter, but I quit after leaving China. I had my own recruitment agency, and did what I could to make sure all expats were treated fairly. I always told them of all potential problems up-front.
When I was recruiting, I even went as far as taking pictures of the schools and the city in question, in addition to compiling a list of important expat-friendly places. Under no circumstances have I ever cheated anyone. I explained the legal Z visa procedure and told them that there's no other way.
Schools would tell me, "No black, no asian, no Indian," and I refused to work with them.
In fact, if I were to go back to China, I'd restart my agency. And I'd do it all without scumbaggery. Expats win, shady recruiters lose.
expatlife26:
OMG you thumbed me down?? How dare you?
you must be one of those abusive people that the marks keep talking about.
You should be blocked, sir! For disagreeing with me!
mike695ca:
Hulk... Im not going to say directly your full of it, but...... i kinda get the feeling.
You say you were a recruiter with your own agency?? Did you forget that your kind of famous on here for the past few years for all of your effed up tales of distress? You were a teacher and proud of it, hunan and hefei was it? I cant remember. But I do remember you were having all kinds of damn trouble getting a visa. And your wifes mom a was bitch, i remember her keeping your girls hukou hostage and you had to bum rush her to get her married and out of China.
But I dont recall ever once you saying you had a recruiting agency. perhaps im wrong and if i am I apologize. But I dont think I am. An owner of a recruitment agency would have an idea of how to get an effing travel visa.
mike695ca:
hulk, not at all man. No axe. I just have a pretty good memory. I can recall random facts about lots of people here. And your tales were pretty interesting in 2012/2013.
Anyways you downvoted him soley on the premise that you had a recruiting agency. Which is wierd because i dont think you did. Anyways, most of us have been here for years so all im asking is you dont treat us like idiots. Thanks!
Hulk:
Mike,
A fool makes assumptions without having all the facts, and jumps to conclusions. That would be you.
My "agency" was just me and my wife, and we were thinking of expanding it. A bunch of schools were asking me to recruit foreigners for them. They were offering me 5k to 10k up-front, or just 1-3k per month that they worked there. I didn't want to take their salary, so I took money up-front from the schools.
Most schools were demanding that foreigners work illegally. I was purposely looking for illegal employment that would result in a legit Z because it wasn't safe to leave my wife there by herself, and my visa was expiring, but I wasn't letting other foreigners fall into the trap I was forced into.
Regardless, I ended up getting a legit Z but bounced once they broke the contract 7 times. There's no way I'm letting my children be born or raised in China - I want what's best for them.
mike695ca:
I wasnt jumping to any conclusions. I was just merely saying that its wierd that you used to talk endlessly about the most random stuff. Every thing that happened in class, every chinese guy that looked at your wrong. A million MIL stories, crappy schools, everything. Yet you never once back in 2013 ( when you left) mentioned a damn word about being a recruiter. When we know you, there would have been a million posts like " Why is being a recruiter so damn messed up!" but maybe I missed that one. If you could show a single post from back than even referencing recruitment. I would sincerly apologize and never question you again Hulk.
Hulk:
I don't mind you questioning me.
Anyway, here: http://answers.echinacities.com/question/are-expat-recruiters-better-or-worse-chinese-recruiters
44 weeks ago.
mike695ca:
Dude, I completely apologize. 100%. Youll never hear me question you again.
Thank you for endulging me.
Hulk:
lol, it's no trouble. Like I said, I don't mind you questioning me. A lot of people bullshit.
I didn't really have that much business anyway because I refused to trap foreign teachers... so fuck it.
I got out of teaching with an offer from one of those 'advisory' companies that charge and arm and a leg for something that you could do yourself if you just did a bit of research.
The services that the company offers are no great shakes - mostly internet research. Then there is help with the application for the Uni/college and help applying for the visa. That's it.
All in all about three hours work per case.
Charged up to 50'000RMB for the initial applications (up to six) then any help thereafter is also charged.
Mental.
Still, I need the money and it pays well. If I don't do it, someone else will.
Luckily I am leaving to go home in August, they don't know that yet. Shhhhh!
expatlife26:
well, if it helps build your resume and it's all you can get, I can see it as a necessary evil for you.
I'd hate doing it though, sounds like you kinda do too or you wouldn't be leaving!
Best of luck with your move back home...hope to join you soon.
In my opinion the worst kinf of expat is the old creeper. Doesnt matter the job. If really wierd seeing like a 55 year old dude chatting up 18 year olds. These dumb girls obviously think that the nice old man wants to be friends and then they are mortified when they find out the truth. Just disgusting. Its generally old people but every age can be creepy. Ive heard expats say some pretty disgusting and direct shit to chinese woman, stuff they would never ever say to a woman back home. They wouldnt have the balls.
The fact that they became teachers disgusts me and they drag down everyone who is here working legitimatly. People say its a small amount, but if everyone has seen them, the numbers cant be too small.
When I was a teacher, SOME of the other teachers hated me because outing creepers was my crusade. I would hold english corners with like 50 people describing what creepy behavior is. ( id find a way to make it language relevant )
For example. Calling a girl beautiful is for your gf, or wife, or family, or a special day. Like a friends wedding day or something. Yet when laowai come here they are telling every girl she is beautiful. They wouldnt at home, yet here its OK. So if a foreigner calls you beautiful HE IS CREEPY. The students loved it... my bosses loved it. The creepers... not so much.
On the flip side. When I see like a 40 or 50 year old foreign man with like a 35 plus aged woman, I feel happy, like hell yeah, theres normal people here. I want to be that dude when im old.
Hulk:
Today I learned I'm a creeper, even though me and my wife are close in age, lol. I used to tell Chinese women when I found them beautiful, but I've done that back home, too. I didn't tell every girl, though... just friends. Not anymore since I'm married.
But... what two consenting adults do isn't really anyone's business. It doesn't make him a creeper for talking to girls half his age; men have always done that. It happens in the west quite often, too. More often than not, money is involved.
Now if they were trying to get it on with underage girls, or if they succeeded in doing so, then it's time to make them disappear. But, like I said before, what two consenting adults do isn't really anyone's business.
expatlife26:
haha I made up a term for younger guys that do that...I call them LOPs (Locals-Only Players)
Talk up their exploits, mack on every average local girl they see, and then when an attractive european girl is around? their eyes go straight to the floor.
You can't say it's a preference thing either...I'm not really into asian women but I can certainly carry myself well around them.
No, the girls they really want are the ones they're afraid to talk to, yet they have this braggadocio like they are total ladies men because they feel interesting to people who, in all likelihood, don't really have a lot of interesting things going on in their lives.
And no...that doesn't apply to ANYONE who has a great, fulfilling relationship with a woman of ANY origin or nationality. That term is for people who use the opportunity of being in a developing country to be the"heartbreaking player they always wanted to be at home but just lacked the chops for; to be the person they always talked shit about but really just didn't have the balls to be. And for the record I would never cheat on anybody and have trouble trusting people who do. If they'd do that to the person who is supposed to trust them, what would they do to me?
mike695ca:
Hahaha LOP, thats awesome.
But too be fair, they are young and they need to get it from somewhere. I cant fully blame them. At least its their age group. I just wish theyd be a little bit more respectful about it.
My problem is generally with the old creepy dude that SEEMS to have only come here to be a full time sexpat. Not cool. It actually makes me angry going to a foreigner pub and seeing grandpas creepily staring at every ass that walks by. But because they are in China, they dont have to hide it.
Hulk:
If someone wants to come to China and spend their money being an expat there because they enjoy the lifestyle, then more power to them. I draw the line at underage girls, though.
expatlife26:
Quality over quantity. That's what I always say.
And hey I don't begrudge anybody their preferences...if you want to go sleeping with a bunch of local uni students, more power to you. But I think some guys (as they are in the west) are misleading about their intentions and that's not right.
Not to be crude but i'd rather sit at home and rub one out than take home a girl i'm not really interested in...unless there is a totally unrealistic-in-the-real-world understanding beforehand about what the intentions are. I'd just feel too guilty stringing someone along, and then what if I do meet a girl I'm really into? I’d like to tell myself I’m too awesome to need prostitutes but I think really I’m just too much of a square.
Yeah those old guys do kinda suck...I've heard it's SO bad like that in Thailand with creepy sexpats. I dunno, what I find unseemly, are sexual pairing that are obviously NOT based on mutual attraction or compatibility or anything.
Actually as I'm writing this i'm realizing that I kinda DO have an economic double standard on this (i.e. an indigent old teacher is creepy for trying to bed young girls, but a successful guy can be (not always) objectively cool doing the same thing)...but hear me out. Like I can believe that the qualities that have made a man successful at 50, can also be objectively attractive to women. The guy who is a natural leader with a ton of charisma and confidence and has risen to be an executive of a big company, probably always was also good with women. I can believe that a young woman with options could be genuinely attracted to him beyond seeking economic advantage. It’s a chicken or the egg thing; I think a lot of times he’s successful as a consequence of being charismatic and confident…NOT the other way around.
The flip side is the old guy who doesn’t have a ton going for him volume shooting trying to find a young girl in a desperate enough situation to seek some temporary comfort at the cost of her sexual dignity. THAT is what makes it creepy.
It’s not that having money makes it cool, it’s that a cool guy who always had the charisma/confidence to be attractive is also likely to have used that same quality to become successful.
Hulk:
Actually, sex tourism = creeping in my personal opinion.
I'm just saying, if they actually get married and are faithful to each other, then that's actually pretty cool.
I guess I didn't understand where you two were coming from, but I definitely don't like when people who sleep around, and it's the same back home. I'm old fashioned, and I can't respect it.
For me, I want one woman for the rest of my life. Boring? Nah. It's safer, too.
mike695ca:
@hilk, is where im specifically coming from, is the creeping. They wouldnt try that stuff with a western woman, and its seen as taboo. But in China everything is OK. I just think its wrong. What could a 55 year old man and a 20 year old possibly have in common?
All I can think of, the woman wants out, and the man is a creeper.
expatlife26:
Yeah i'm kinda old fashioned too in that sense...but I don't fault someone for wanting to sleep around.
just for misrepresenting themselves.
The fact is most guys can't pull off being players while not lying or misleading...hell I think that's why a lot of famous guys (I think perfectly understandably) use escort services.
ScotsAlan:
Quote:
"On the flip side. When I see like a 40 or 50 year old foreign man with like a 35 plus aged woman, I feel happy, like hell yeah, theres normal people here. I want to be that dude when im old.'
Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha HA HA.
Oh man, if you think you are old when you hit 40 you are in for a rough ride 
.
Contrary to what seems to be a popular myth, your penis does not fall off when you reach thirty nine and three quarters . Nor do you need little blue pills to be able to hang a flag from it 
.
To Expatlife26: Wow, think I actually know the shifty fucker your talking about. Sounds like a slim chance but suprising how many people know the guy who brought me out from the UK, luckily got out of that bullshit quickly but I know some people that got bullied/taken advantage of for far too long... praying on people out of their comfort zone in a country where the vast majority don't speak english.
Ironic how the locals treat you much better than a fucker from your own country! I got out of the ESL game as i just saw it as a stepping stone to China and a means to an end financially until I could find something more worthwhile... I don't think people taking ESL jobs is a bad thing at all, majority of the world can speak english and after travelling to many countries, China has a lot of catching up to do. What I don't agree with is the system, acting a clown, schools and learning centres not having the authority to sponsor working visas but still insisting to teachers they can, employers not paying on time and contracts not worth the paper they are written on.
Not because im a native english speaker, but let's face it, English is important worldwide so in theory all the language centers, schools and foreigners teaching english is a good thing... just a hell of a lot of work needs to be done to execute it efficiently and legally.
expatlife26:
Thatd be funny if it was the same guy. He was about 6 feet tall, kinda fat, about 30. Mike something. Kind of a mean spirited dork type. Think thats him??
Seem like it depends on the person, not the job. I don't quite get the down-talking on Esl or other teachers; some are respectable - like one I work with who is in his 40's and sees his life as a way to help others fulfill their dreams, and does a good job at it IMO. Seems like you could find respectable people as well as creeps in similar proportions across different professions, no?q
Haha, "mean-spirited dork type" recruiter.
I know a guy like him. I mentioned him before in a post. Some British guy (another one?) but his name is James. He would recruit for a company and was a total and complete sell out and jerk. Here is a list of his credentials:
- would go after extremely young women
- would make-up with them in the office (WTF, while people are there... yup)
- would lie to foreigners to get them to China
- would take them out to bars, speak Chinese to locals and get the foreigners beat up saying shit like "This foreigner just said you should go fuck your mother..."
- would go missing for days and say he is busy... then brag and tell everyone he had all platinum trophies on his PS3 games (wonder what he was "busy" doing)
- would suck up to the Chinese bosses hardcore (hence why he wasn't fired)
- would tell other teachers that if they go to a meeting with other foreigners, ESL teachers are at the bottom of the food chain and the other foreigners will look down on them
Just a total dick. I have seen MANY Creepers, LOP, the nutters, the Chinese wife-beaters and so much more... all foreigners. Just the other day, I was at the bar... and this drink guy... younger like 22-24.. was harshly hitting on a chick and kept saying, "come on, come on, let's go back to my place... come on." Local Chinese men were around and I could tell it was annoying them... it was starting to piss me off too until he realized someone was going to knock him out and he went to chase after another one.
You are right expatlife26, there are big time LOPs that wouldn't DARE go to up to a Western girl and be like, "Let's go back to my place." "No." "Come on!" "No." "Come on, come on... let's go!" "No." "Yeah, come to my place... you know you want to! You are so hot! Come on!"
At that point, guy would probably get nut sacked or his jaw broken. I kind of chased him off by giving him the look like... "enough is enough". The Chinese bartenders were grateful I did and were really happy to see me the next time.
expatlife26:
Hahaha thank you for helping me popularize the term LOP...i really like that one. Again it's 100% not about putting down a guy in a good relationship with any woman they feel something for...it's about looking down on guys for unethical behavior they wouldn't have the chops for back home.
yeah there is that kind of person you see a lot here...the type that really is kind of an outcast at home because of their own personality problems.
We bitch (rightfully so) about how a lot of locals throw all social rules of conduct out the window when dealing with foreigners, but there is definitely that kind of westerner who does the exact same thing.
I'm of the philosophical school that free choice is a necessary component of morality. I can make an argument that I am eco-friendly (though I don't!) because I could buy a car this very day but I don't mind taking the metro. But, I'd be completely full of shit if I wanted a pat on the back for not taking the corporate jet because I'm not allowed to.
By the same token you get a lot of guys from back home that really hate women. The "nice guys" who you find on those misogynist website reading articles like "Why you should encourage eating disorders!" I think you take a lot of those guys who just don't know how to be interesting to western women, put them here where the red flags in their body language and personality aren't as apparent and they try to become the heartbreaking players the always wanted to be...but couldn't. All their "nice" was just their lack of ability, not any kind of moral stance.
I bet these asshole recruiters really didn't fit in back home...and not cause of the "shallowness of mainstream society", cause there are TONS of subcultures back home you know? These people were assholes to the other Marvel Cosplay people too, and just had no friends. They see other expats as enemies, people who can see through them where the locals are "safe" because their personality flaws are harder to detect to an outsider.
I just Googled " teach English in China", and clicked on a site at random. I got this:
http://www.ciee.org/teach/china/immersion/visa.aspx
Nice website. But hey, come on guys, you are telling people you can work on an F visa. That's not good. But hey, I will let it go because your website is soooooo cool.
Ahh, wait I thought,:maybe they are offering internships. I clicked here:
http://www.ciee.org/teach/china/immersion/compensation.aspx
Paid positions it seems. Potential to earn a whacking 5000 RMB a month.
To anyone who has never been to China, but is considering taking up a teaching job here.... I would urge you to be very careful. Read as many forums about it as you can, and digest what you read.
ScotsAlan:
It's ok. I was totally wrong about the above site I found.
Seems you have to pay them. Up front.
http://www.ciee.org/teach/china/abroad/fees.aspx
No problem there then. We all know all the best jobs need an application fee.
Well, actually, I know it's illegal in the UK. But as this site is aimed at Americans it must be legal there.
Robk:
lol...
I just used the latest "Google Scam Translation" tool and it was how it translated it:
"Get screwed hard by breaking local laws and paying for your own visa. Travel around the world where you are vunerable, stupid and ignorant so you can be taken advantage of easily! All at the high application price of a few thousand dollars! That's right... this is a limited time only offer because someone is going to shut us down or call our scam. It's the chance of a life time to create a memory you won't easily forget, even if you try!"
ESL recruiting is a legitimate and profitable profession. Ted is right - generalizing all recruiters based on only a handful is wrong. But these guys here should be beheaded in T Square!
expatlife26:
That's NOT for you to say that recruiting is a good or bad professional. The CFTU clearly says it's not and they're the experts. In fact I contacted them and they said that if you have recruiter one person for one job you're going to hell.
Why don't you keep your thoughts to yourself, almost? You HAVE NO RIGHT TO TALK ABOUT RECRUITERS. That subject is for CFTU representatives ONLY.
