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502BadGateway

Posts: 8

Governor

Q: Filing arbitration and other things.

Just moved to Beijing and successfully got a new FEC+transferred my visa.
My previous employer broke my contract numerous times, threatened me, admitted to doing illegal things on video, and took 14000 from my salary without any good reason.
Back in January I told the bureau, and they made her sit down to negotiate with me.
Little did I know she lied on our agreement and started taking more pay, had changed our written agreement in the Chinese version, and continued breaking my contract in numerous ways.

Now, just like back in January, I kept all the proof and am getting ready to submit it for filing arbitration.
Any opinions on filing arbitration? How long do you have after leaving an employer to file it?

My fiance has a masters in law and is helping me the best she can, but I want some outside advice as well.
On a final note, I reported her to the immigration office back in the U.S. for filing fraudulent paperwork to get her tourist visa (I sent the proof).

Any opinions of the situation? P.S. Don't come at me with sensational 'possibilities', she's just a blowhard with a lot of borrowed money in the small city of Chifeng, Inner Mongolia.

7 years 38 weeks ago in Visa & Legalities - China

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ironman510

Posts: 4422

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Id say you are wasting your time. In China the Chinese side wins 99% of the time. It'll be laughable, haven't you ever been laughed at by a Chinese when they are wrong? They'll laugh at you in silence. Thus your case will be lost or both sides win by nothing actually happening. That's how it China in works. I really wouldn't put your passport# through this mess. You got your new job, so move on.

502BadGateway:

I agree about their attitude towards these matters.

HOWEVER, SAFEA sided with ME the first time she broke the contract and I played the waiting game to gather evidence, I don't know why they wouldn't a second time.
ESPECIALLY considering now other teachers have done the same.
She has a rep.

7 years 38 weeks ago

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7 years 38 weeks ago

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icnif77

Posts: 19798

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I read similar post here of somebody (diff. handle) with same troubles in the same city in IM, some 4 months ago....

'How long do you have after leaving an employer to file it?'

I've never filled law suit against employer in China, but I was tempted several times.

I think, the weakest point of laowai suing Chinese is you are bound by visa. I am not sure, how Court would get you back to China for trial, if your RP expired and you're out of China.

You can also expect tedious, long process with marginal chance of winning/gaining retribution.

Much shorter and (in my case) very successful way is 'SAFEA' (Foreign Expert Bureau), same Gov.'s office, which issued your FEC.

Dial them up, and ask for the help and advice. They'll make sure, you'll get everything back what was taken off you unlawful way.

You can get Gov.'s address and contact no. by entering 'safea' in search above.

502BadGateway:

My RP and FEC is good for 2 years, just freshly transferred to Beijing.
I already contacted SAFEA, just asking other people their opinions and experiences with Arbitration.

7 years 38 weeks ago

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icnif77:

There was thread of somebody, who took school or it was Insurance claim to Court some year or two ago. His handle was with no. 2 in the middle, it's all I remember.

But yeah, SAFEA will be sufficient, except if you'll sue for the punitive damage....

7 years 38 weeks ago

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7 years 38 weeks ago

Englteachted

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Englteachted

Posts: 5156

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Your post is questionable. If they pilfered your money then SAfea would have made them pay you (happened to me) no need to renegotiate anything. Your wife is a law expert but you did not let her or any other trusted friend read over the Chinese version. You screwed up and got out, post the school and info to warn others and let it go.

Your wife is a legal expert but you're asking a bunch of idiots on this site?

I'm gonna give you the answer your wife should have already told you, you need to hire a lawyer for at least 10k and either way you'll be screwed.

ironman510:

Agreed, something fishy.

7 years 38 weeks ago

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502BadGateway:

They took 2000 RMB per month for 6 months straight AFTER SAFEA told them to sit and negotiate with me about either finishing my contract peacefully or letting me go with relevant papers in hand to transfer jobs (seeing as I had her on VIDEO saying she won't give the legally required docs).

I decided to play the waiting game and gather evidence instead of trying to fight outright, which I still think was the best choice.
After I got all my paperwork transferred for my new FEC and RP, I sent an email to the same SAFEA agent who helped me before with all the proof.

My next step is call them up a second time to follow up on the info.
Nothing fishy here, just read my post thoroughly.
Honestly, no idea what is up with you people and your doubts of people's posts when they just want an honest opinion of someone who ALREADY went through the process.

IF YOU had any experience at all in these matters, it would be obvious to you that a law student with a masters still would not know all the experiences foreigners have had with such matters. They would just know what they themselves can do to make sure the evidence is sufficient and to help follow up with SAFEA if they feel too lazy to answer the damn phone. AS for the Chinese version of the 'agreement', it turns out the agreement is null considering it simply says she 'punished me for breaking the contract', but does not specify at all what the punishment was or the contract break. We asked SAFEA about this during the first phone call and they said she simply had no proof of a contract break sufficient enough to warrent taking 14000 RMB from me. On a final note, SAFEA helped me get my money back the first time DURING my contract, but I thought the process was different if you finish the contract and then file a complaint, I realize now it's the same..

7 years 38 weeks ago

After I got all my paperwork transferred for my new FEC and RP, I sent an email to the same SAFEA agent who helped me before with all the proof.My next step is call them up a second time to follow up on the info.Nothing fishy here, just read my post thoroughly.

Honestly, no idea what is up with you people and your doubts of people\'s posts when they just want an honest opinion of someone who ALREADY went through the process.

AS for the Chinese version of the \'agreement\', it turns out the agreement is null considering it simply says she \'punished me for breaking the contract\', but does not specify at all what the punishment was or the contract break. We asked SAFEA about this during the first phone call and they said she simply had no proof of a contract break sufficient enough to warrent taking 14000 RMB from me.

On a final note, SAFEA helped me get my money back the first time DURING my contract, but I thought the process was different if you finish the contract and then file a complaint, I realize now it\'s the same..

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Englteachted:

If you had any sense, then you would know legal channels and protocols have nothing to do with being a foreigner. You didn't need to negotiate an end to the contract. Contracts can be terminated with 30-60 days notice. Also why wait 6 months? After the first month of her taking 2000rmb, you should have gone to SAFEA and violating the contract can mean immediate termination of the contract.

Also how would you know anything about her tourist visa application? Second, the embassy is the one who issues tourist visas that is where one would report something like that. If you are American you would know that is wasted energy, they don't give a shit.

7 years 38 weeks ago

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502BadGateway:

I wasn't negotiating an end to the contract, I was negotiating whether I will leave and take 6 months of pay or she will give me the money she took back and I will finish the contract simply out of good faith.
I have ALL of the dirt on her, I know everything illegal she's done in the past 4 years.
Don't ask how.
The point is, I reported her to the relevent authorities in the U.S. for committing fraud on her visa application after finding out the true numbers of her husband's company among other things.
You should also take note that any American knows you don't report it to the Embassy you dolt, you report it to USCIS.

As for the second line of contract breaks in a row, I couldn't just immediately report it to SAFEA because as you may or may not know in Inner Mongolia you need a local to even help you make phone calls over MULTIPLE days before getting one person on the line, much less getting someone you can email the proof to.
Seeing as my fiance was working full time in Beijing, it wasn't really easy to do for the whole time period, and I had to consider how much money I had saved up in comparison to how much I needed to just leave the job and have enough to hold me over until a new job picks up my visa paperwork.

7 years 38 weeks ago

I wasn\'t negotiating an end to the contract, I was negotiating whether I will leave and take 6 months of pay or she will give me the money she took back and I will finish the contract simply out of good faith.I have ALL of the dirt on her, I know everything illegal she\'s done in the past 4 years.Don\'t ask how.The point is, I reported her to the relevent authorities in the U.S. for committing fraud on her visa application after finding out the true numbers of her husband\'s company among other things.You should also take note that any American knows you don\'t report it to the Embassy you dolt, you report it to USCIS. As for the second line of contract breaks in a row, I couldn\'t just immediately report it to SAFEA because as you may or may not know in Inner Mongolia you need a local to even help you make phone calls over MULTIPLE days before getting one person on the line, much less getting someone you can email the proof to.Seeing as my fiance was working full time in Beijing, it wasn\'t really easy to do for the whole time period, and I had to consider how much money I had saved up in comparison to how much I needed to just leave the job and have enough to hold me over until a new job picks up my visa paperwork.

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Englteachted:

What you're saying makes no sense, you decided to stay but you talk about all this taking money but yet you refused to exercise the 30 day out? USCIS deals with immigrants or visa holders already in the states. What are they gonna do deport her?

7 years 38 weeks ago

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Zethe:

They revoked her tourist visa and banned her for 5 years.

7 years 34 weeks ago

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Zethe:

See here for the results of the case:
http://answers.echinacities.com/question/safea-helps-resolve-case-mediation-favor-ft?type=alatest#answer000

Also, please don't comment on my posts again, you're a toxic troll.

7 years 34 weeks ago

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7 years 38 weeks ago

ironman510

Posts: 4422

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502BadGateway:

I agree about their attitude towards these matters.

7 years 38 weeks ago

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7 years 38 weeks ago

robaird

Posts: 58

Governor

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I know a good Shanghai based lawyer who, for the ample sum of 500,000 kuai and without any fiduciary responsibility, will take your claim to the highest authorities.

Having said that, caveat emptor.

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7 years 38 weeks ago

502BadGateway

Posts: 8

Governor

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Thanks everyone for the answers, but SAFEA has helped me resolve the issue.
They issued an order for her to pay me back the money she took and now I'm just waiting.

bfconnelly:

Ignore these knuckleheads. They might as well be Chinese dudes attacking each other over KFC and Nikes. Thanks for the good read and advice. Glad your situation got resolved appropriately.

7 years 38 weeks ago

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7 years 38 weeks ago

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Original Text:

Questing title : Filing arbitration and other things. 
		
Questing description : Just moved to Beijing and successfully got a new FEC+transferred my visa. My previous employer broke my contract numerous times, threatened me, admitted to doing illegal things on video, and took 14000 from my salary without any good reason. Back in January I told the bureau, and they made her sit down to negotiate with me. Little did I know she lied on our agreement and started taking more pay, had changed our written agreement in the Chinese version, and continued breaking my contract in numerous ways.
Now, just like back in January, I kept all the proof and am getting ready to submit it for filing arbitration. Any opinions on filing arbitration? How long do you have after leaving an employer to file it?
My fiance has a masters in law and is helping me the best she can, but I want some outside advice as well. On a final note, I reported her to the immigration office back in the U.S. for filing fraudulent paperwork to get her tourist visa (I sent the proof).
Any opinions of the situation? P.S. Don't come at me with sensational 'possibilities', she's just a blowhard with a lot of borrowed money in the small city of Chifeng, Inner Mongolia.

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