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Sign up with Google Sign up with FacebookQ: Leaving UK with tourist visa and exchanging it for work visa in China? (CTP Changzhi School, Shanxi)
I just got a job in a school, teaching English to children in Changzhi.
The school would like me to leave with a tourist visa, and this would be exchanged for a work visa when I arrive in China, I'm told. I am applying through TEFL Panda, and it seems fairly legitimate, but I actually know very little information about this school. And now I'm having a few second thoughts about whether this is a good idea.
I am getting a bit of pressure that they want me out there asap, also. And need to rush through my visa application. Am I making a mistake, in your opinion? Thanks.
10 years 33 weeks ago in Visa & Legalities - China
Probably yes, you're making mistake! You shouldn't leave UK without Z visa!
I'm guessing, your Co. is not authorized to hire Foreign teachers, and cannot sponsor Z.
Once, you're in China, they'll get you business visa (F ), but it is illegal to work and receive salary in China with other visa than Z. Business visa used to be called F, and I'm not sure what is correct letter now.
If you'll find another School, which will be able to sponsor Z visa, you'll be required to return to UK, and apply for Z in Chinese Embassy in London.
Rarely, your new School will be 'powerful' enough to apply for Z in Hong Kong.
Never mind for 'School wants ASAP'! You're required by Chinese law to exit China, when apply for Z visa. Right School should send all required docs. to Chinese Embassy in UK, which should grant you Z, and only then you should enter China.
Web link of Chinese Schools, authorized to hire FT, and sponsor Z:
http://www.anesl.com/schools/info.asp?province=Guangdong&keyword=University&cmd=Search
Change Province, and the level of School, and enter the name of the School. Link is from 2012, and might be a bit out dated.
Thanks guys! The school is called CTP Changzhi School. It isn't on the list. :(
However, I am not entirely sure but I think the school may be new, or it may be listed under another name. I am a bit worried now though, if they aren't authorised to hire foreign workers what does this mean and why would they employ me?
icnif77:
They want you to work in China on different visa, because you can't seek Government (SAFEA) protection when they'll screw you while you're working for them.
You shouldn't enter China with other visa than Z, if you plan to work here!
Why?They want to employ you, because they can't sponsor Z! It's much less complicated to apply for F. Edit your Q on the top, and enter full name of the School, city and Province in your Q. Other FTs will be able to get info by entering name of the School in search bar.I edited the Q. The name of the school is CTP Changzhi School, Changzhi, Shanxi province.
I got the impression the school might be new or something? I don't have a lot of information about it, since I'm mostly dealing with the person from TEFL panda who is acting as my recruiter. But, I did sign a contract with the school already!
icnif77:
Contract you signed is not valid! By Chinese law, you can work in China only with Z visa, which get turned into Residence permit in 30 days after your entry.
Both, you and your employer are against Chinese law, if you'll enter (and work) in China on any other visa than Z.
Tell that to your recruiter, and write us what your recruiter replied.
if the school wants you out there as soon as possible, tell them you will be as soon as they provide the correct documents for a 'Z' visa.
if the recruiter tries to BS you, just refuse, as they are clearly not legit.
no job here in China is worth being illegal for, no matter what they promise, because you can be sure they will ***** you over
EDIT
if you are in the UK at the moment, send your recruited a clear and unambiguous email. They should get back to you by the time you are awake tomorrow (GMT)
sorrel:
lol
i notice i have annoyed the phantom 'down-thumber' again, despite having a fairly neutral answer
Stay classy who-ever you are
Fully agree with the other responses. IF you do come out here and they actually do process the paperwork to get a Z visa you then have to go back to your home country to apply for the Z visa as you can't do it in Hong Kong anymore.
Who is going to pay of that return flight?
TBH they are bullshitting you. Once you get here on the tourist visa they will not make you legal...more than likely get you a dodgy business visa and then you'll need to do visa runs every 30 or 60 days.
Okay - I got a response from my recruiter.
She said that a regular work visa in China requires two years work experience and a TEFL qualification (I am still working on getting my TEFL right now). So I am not eligible for that, since I am still working on getting my TEFL. Is this true?
She mentioned that a business visa rather than a work visa might be another option? I'm kind of confused now really.
Thanks everyone for the responses. Very disapointing to me! But I appreciate the advice.
Now recruiter has offered me contact details of British person working without a working visa for several years. So I guess that means I was never going to get a working visa, which they never actually made very clear to me at all. Very sceptical now of this.
sorrel:
don't give up
complete your TEFL and apply again to other positions - and to other countries
China is not the be-all and end-all of being an English teacher
icnif77:
You might work several years without proper visa, but you cannot seek advice from Chinese Government, what means employer can take advantage of you, and nobody will defend you.
advantages:
- lower salary than agreed by Contract;
- salary not paid on time;
- more hours required to work, then per Contract;
- apartment not suitable for living;
an so on.
FT with Z visa can always turn to Foreign Expert Bureau (SAFEA), which will help to resolve problems with School, but if you're here with F, you must listen and obey your employer in anything she/he desire!
Tefl Panda, Grace is it there ......................................run a mile from this outfit and any that dont give you documents to process (z) visa at home, and then come to China on (z)
if you come to China on (l or f) visa, you will have to fly home to the UK to process, and who do you think pays for that flight and the other little expenses
do yourself a favour (finish your tefl), Chinese Government dont care how many hours your tefl is (20,40,60 or more hours is all the same to them)
whats important is you have one.
save your self so much misery by waiting until a proper school do the bizo
plus they will bend you over every chance they get, you need to have the protection of the z visa (that way when they do try to fxxx you , you can go to PSB
Simple, what they are asking you to do is illegal. If anything goes wrong, you are screwed. Find another school and do it legally.
Right TEFL Panda, from what I know about them, is they are a third even fourth party. They reel you in and then pass you to a local Agency. They 'hire' you but you actually sign a contract with someone completely different i.e. you will never meet the Panda people. He/She is relaying information from the particular Agency he/she wants to get you in with. They no doubt take some commission - whether a sign on fee or part of your monthly.
I'm not saying there's anything particularly bad about them but the whole thing reeks of sneakiness imo. Sometimes/probably all the time they will not know what exact school will hire you. It is the school that gets you the Z Visa. So therefore the Agency can only offer a Business Visa at the most. You'll go to HK and apply for a Z Visa later when your school is onboard. It just takes first of all risk away for the Agency, BUT you do have the power to walk away, as any contract that will be signed, with say Business Visa, is null and void, power to you. Also you will pay for flights, medical and other sundries when they haven't paid for anything. There will not be any Chinese lessons on offer. The agency will change your CV for you - to lie to the PSB that you have the required experience - without the blink of an eye. This is after you secure the job and the kids/teachers/school like you. Risk aversion or management. Everything will be in their favour - always. Read your contract carefully - ask as many questions as you can muster up. Judge them then maybe.
ChengduPat:
Just another few thoughts, why would an agency so willingly give away the name of the school. Couldn't you apply directly then to the school bypassing Agency. They take great care in protecting themselves. I bet when you arrive they would have a different school for you, maybe out of town a little, you would be at their mercy.
I went through TEFL Panda, signed with another Agency here through them, haven't heard from Panda in ages, having problems with Agency, fixed with tough negotiation.
Saw my CV they submitted to PSB, hahum. Would have been qualified anyway. TEFL Panda's job ads are brief and designed to draw you in.
In saying all of this my experience has been good, yet I would have left/walked away whilst on F Visa, only for my reasons being here, the school and kids are great also. If you can battle and speak up for yourself you should be fine.
They will find you a post or set you up in your school, look after visa stuff. That is actually all they are good for. I came on F moved to Z and have RP and FEC now, nothing to do with TEFL Panda but the agency I work for.