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Q: Is this a place for 'venting' and implied /hostile critisism or for constructive help and advice?
Perhaps we should add an extra category - 'vents and anger' ?
I feel that it is for both, but, since this is a site for expats, i feel that the "venting" should take priority over "constructive criticism and advice".
In addition, this is like a numbers game. There are much fewer chinese people who come to this site than there are foreigners. So, making it harder for us to be able to vent when we need to on the off chance that one of the locals just might be offended seems to be putting an extra burden that we just dont need. After all, in so many ways, our life is much harder and more complicated as it is.
If you go to Chinasmack, they translate the comments that the Chinese themselves make about China, and they can be brutally direct compared to what we write here.
Bottom line, this is a website geared towards foreigners. The Chinese community is welcome to join and participate, but they should not change the focus of what the purpose of this site is for: Information for expats living in Beijing. We do not need yet another forum that only extols the virtues of China. We have way too many of them!
lokethebloke:
Good points Raf, thanks for that, helps with my understanding.
Being british,and old I tend to keep my venting to myself, unless I'm truly provoked and then I tend to go over 'the top'. I will endeavour to 'curb my enthusiasm', for a fight. But it is very difficult with the likes of some on here.
GuilinRaf:
I understand you fully. That is why, even when I do vent, I always try to "tie in" my hometown as well. However, there are times that the problems are unique only to one place or the other.
Except for here, I too usually keep my "venting" to myself. Not only because I am the only Westerner in my University, my Chinese friends would not understand and may even be offended. I do not vent with my friends back in the "West" (I have friends in the US, Canada, Venezuela and France) because they too would not understand (and would even have a skewed view about China, which for me would be unacceptable). I do have my good and bad days here as everyone else, but I do like living here in China and I do appreciate the Chinese as well.
Completely hated the movie "The Green Hornet" as I did not like Kato. We have long passed the era of the "Chinese Man-Servant" and on top of that, the Green hormet was an idiot. His plans came from his secretary and his inventions came from Kato. And he got the credit...
But I digress....
GuilinRaf:
Lol, my sister likes him too! Lucky for you, my sister is also married....
Maybe you should stop worrying about what other people post all the time.
lokethebloke:
My problem is that I worry about what the likes of you post, must be the old grandpa in me.
nevermind:
Worry about it elsewhere. No one gives a crap to conform to your little ideas of what we should think.
nevermind:
I'd rather be openly hostile than a smarmy coward pretending not to be purposely starting trouble and insulting people.
Debate is good. So what if someone wants to criticize seemingly unfairly all the time. If their arguments are weak then they'll come across as a blathering idiot anyway. If what they are saying is correct then the truth shouldn't hurt anyone. The intelligent and broad minded Chinese people I know here fully acknowledge that China is a developing country and is still work in progress in a lot of areas, and aren't afraid to admit it.
Why exactly can't it be both? Or perhaps, why shouldn't it?
lokethebloke:
My point is why not a seperate category for both? So that the likes of me, stupid and senile, can recognise and ignore the more hostile stuff and then I can get on with my life without getting my knickers in a twist.
mattsm84:
I too wish that websites and business that I frequent would cater to my desires and whims specifically, other users and costumers be damned. Yet, when that doesn't happen, as is often the case, I never wonder why.
Why don't you do yourself a favor and avoid topics that you might find inflammatory?
lokethebloke:
That's my point, if there was a specific category (topic) for venting then I could ignore it or not.
mattsm84:
But then why should a specific category exist for something you should probably be able to do yourself? Or, put another way, how is making sure you don't read something that makes you angry or upset anyone else's problem? Part of the issue that other people seem to have with you, Mart, and hugh is that any one of the three of you seem to be able to take any given topic as a opportunity to go off on a rant about something that is either only tangentially related to the subject, or about something else entirely. Wouldn't a better solution be for you make more of an effort to stay on topic, and ignore topics that you feel are apt to set you off?
lokethebloke:
In that case Mat, why have all these other categories?
- Arts & Entertainment(562) New
- Business & Jobs(689)
- Culture(975)
- Family & Kids(168)
- Food(699) New
- General(2159) New
- Health & Safety(716) New
- Housing(222)
- Lifestyle(375)
- Money & Banking(184)
- Relationships(520) New
- Shopping(410)
- Sports(196)
- Teaching & Learning(697) New
- Transport & Travel(616)
- Visa & Legalities(430) New
- Web & Technology(
mattsm84:
Based on what I know of web design, I suspect that it might be so that other people that have the same questions can have an easier time finding out if its been asked before. Having a "venting" or even an "off topic" page would be counter productive. From a purely web design orientated perspective there probably shouldn't even be a "General" page, as most of the questions would better be filled under a different heading and it can easily become bloated. Strictly speaking, where would you file a question like "why is my apartment so damn moldy?" Health is applicable. As is work if your apartment is provided by your employer. Venting would then also be acceptable. It's poor design really.
mattsm84:
You could try emailing the moderator. I'd advise sitting tight and just using the forum like you have been, save for the other suggestions I've made.
maybe we should just ignore you (loke/ marty/ huhg)
this site was set up for one purpose but has blossomed into something much much more. that equates t more ad revenue. that equates to savings because they can pull posts and comments to make a few articles for their other section. free expression is precious and should never be muted.
back to my first point, i apologize for my part (to the respected posters on this site). in responding to you (loke/ hughg, marty) I have helped you to poison this site and drive people away. i look at the active members box and i notice many respected members are not there.
from here on out i will ignore loke/marty/ hugh and any other accounts he creates to start trouble.
mArtiAn:
Actually i'm just one person. Not meaning to poison this site either, on the contrary, i've only spoken up when it's seemed to me that healthy venting had progressed into something unhealthy. In actual fact I think i've probably made a bit of a fool of myself with the amount of preachy, goody-goody crap i've spouted over the past few months; most of the negative comments on this forum 'are' just people going through the natural problems of acclimatizing to a foreign culture. I don't expect to shut my mouth entirely as sometimes I do find certain comments here quite deeply offensive. Some comments, it seems, do come from a place of genuine racism, and you don't have to be a member of the Chinese race to be offended by them. But on the whole I think i'm going to try to view negative comments in general in a more understanding light.
lokethebloke:
I don't understand this, can someone translate into english please. "this site was set up for one purpose but has blossomed into something much much more. that equates t more ad revenue. that equates to savings because they can pull posts and comments to make a few articles for their other section. free expression is precious and should never be muted".
Does what you say about ignoring me mean that we will not be meeting in Harbin on the 1st January? Good job that I didn't rearrange my flight tickets. I can assure you that I will not be ignoring any of your future hostile generalised comments here, let's see what happens.
I don't believe that YOU asked this Question.....Thank God Crimo and Martian did not answer this question yet..........Am waiting for the rumble..............WAHAHA
Createach:
Damn.........I was Clicking SUBMIT but Crimo beat me to it......................Hard Luck to me
Vent away, just be aware, whether you like it or not your venting will be seen by many as typical of those people from your nation and expats in general. Therefore so long as you make it clear you aren't British I don't mind that much, except when you trash the whole nation, then I will point out your racism and / or sweeping generalisation, because much as I don't like it, often expats are viewed as one big nation of weigou and we all get lumped together so in such cases your venting affects me.
When another nation is different from your own it is NOT that nations fault that it is different. It just is.
I have been in China for a year and just recently started looking at this site for "some local english" and certainly don't see it as a venting or simply a critical place..... we all need to speak our minds from time to time ....... can't be politically correct all the time ( i.e. Joe Biden) f*****ing big deal ................. I like the guy........I'm Canadian I like China because they can and will make a decision ....checks and balances in Canada and USA have evened out so much in the past generation that nothing ever gets done..........everything is 50/50 ........... need a boss to make a decision.....I am more than willing to accept the position but I need all of China to vote for me
Joe Walsh was on Piers Morgan TV thing today ...... and he said it ..... it is CONGRESS that is the problem ............. too balanced and 50/50 is not a good bet to make!!!!!!!!!!!!!! if you want to get ahead in the long run!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Though there are many offensive comments here,i read them all.Then I consider whether the comment is reasonable or not and why he/she has that thought,i also think about my own view on the topics in discussion and decide if my view is biased as well.So, generally speaking,i think it's not that bad to hear different views,even if they are opposite sometimes,and even if some are quite offensive.
GuilinRaf:
Yes, and t his is where our Chinese friends come in and help! "Tommy" is having a bad day in "X place. He comes here, frustrated and vents. The expats who have been here longer, give their understanding. The expats who have been here are warned and the Chinese readers can oftentimes clarify the "why". Maybe it is cultural, maybe it is legal, etc.
Loke, What ever the site is, why do you think you are lord and master of it? You commented once that you agreed with a post I made and rarely do. I'll speak for myself, I'm not looking for your approval. I try to post humourously, sometimes I miss, sometimes I'm even serious.
You seem to be a bully, rarely helpful. I never read one comment from you that has even made me chuckle. I don't see as helping anyone. What is your purpose here, just to be a negative force?
I really can't stand being around negative people. In my real life I'm always kidding. I try to find humour in every thing, some times I look foolish. Life is alot easier if you can make people laugh around you. Try it.
I haven't seen a Mission Statement of any kind so in my opinion I would say the site is to be used for whatever purpose each individual poster sees fit. Nothing wrong with that.
Loke, I have to say that your question has a distinctive Chinese-feel to it. Let me explain it in this way: At three of the universities I have worked at here I have noticed a similar phenomenon. The authorities, although for the most part, the students are not committing any crimes or engaging in rowdy behavior, there are campus fences and gates locked everywhere. It wreaks of controlling behavior for the sole sake of controlling the masses. Your post (even though it s a question) has that clear implication as far as I'm concerned. Ted's observation that you are a bully may be accurate as well. You do come across as a Chinese sympathizer whether it is your intent or not. That in itself is not a bad thing as to some extent, I suppose we all find some truths in your "look in the mirror technique". However, you do seem to push the matter to the extreme on many occasions. If you disagree with someone that, in no way means they are wrong. In my estimation, you are running the risk of moving from "loke the bloke" to "loke the j.......". Sorry if that's harsh but I have read so many of your posts and I think this had to be said.
snowballeffect:
'Chinese sypmathiser' - please, what makes you and your country so fookin special?
Thank you for that Derek, and I agree entirely with what you say.
My 'mission statement' at the beginning of all this was to highlight all the foul stuff being spouted on this site over the years and hold up a mirror to those who do the spouting. It's very simple, too many people are reading too much into what I'm doing. Yes sometimes I've been extreme and I make no apology for it because at times this site appears to me to be an extreme 'anti china corner'. As for being a bully, that's all I'm doing is reflecting some of the bullying tactics used by some of the people here to stifle debate and frighten people away.
Do you really think that I believe some of the rubbish that I've being spouting, of course I don't but as I keep saying over and over again, I'm holding up a mirror to those who are in my opinion spouting hostile rubbish.
If that turns me into 'loke the joke' then so be it. I have no face.
Why is coming across as a chinese sympathiser seen as a bad thing? Yes I am a chinese sympathiser, I see the mess that this country is in and I sympathise, you could also see me as a sympathiser of the United States of America, I don't need to tell you how much of a mess that country is in and as for my own, well ever since the election of that woman, who's name shall not be spoken (private joke) it's been down hill ever since. ( Apart from when there was a spark of hope in 1997).
I'm just hoping that one day crimo and his followers will realise that there is more than one way to skin a cat.
I do think since Loke, mArtiAn and myself have started pointing out the sillier, more sweeping generalisations it has definitely been noticeable that we have more Chinese posters.
Could that be that they now see this site as safer, less offensive, perhaps even less racist now they have some confidence that native level English speakers are likely to challenge the more outrageous comments?
Hugh.G.Rection:
Got to love you Crimo, I didn't think you would be able to ignore us for long.
I get the impression that there's less implied China criticism in the questions lately.
