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Sign up with Google Sign up with FacebookQ: Is there a wall between you and the Chinese English teachers you work with?
I've worked at a number of schools now and never been friends with any of my Chinese coworkers. Even found simple conversation that's non-work related can be like pulling teeth. and it's not cuz of their English. In some schools I've worked, might share a laugh in the teachers room or help each other with language. That would be the friendliest. In others, not even that. But outside work, never done anything together, unless it's a school organized function. I don't even know what they do. Last Christmas I threw a party and invited them and as expected they all bowed out. I could tell they didn't want to come.
Is there any reason for this? I'm pretty sure it's not just me. I would think that people who chose English as a career path would be more inclined to make English speaking friends, but the reverse seems to be true in the schools. I don't know that this is as true in training centers and kindergartens. Though I have less experience with that. Do they resent us because we make much more than them and work less? I know many become teachers because it's a good job to attract a husband who has money. Would being around foreigners compromise that?
8 years 47 weeks ago in Teaching & Learning - China
There are certain stigmas in Chinese society like if they hang around and talk to a foreigner too much... they must be interested in that foreigner or sleeping with him. Chinese think like this... Chinese are bored and like to make up tons of gossip.
Some teachers are afraid of foreigners. Why?
Because they don't want to be exposed. It is quite possible their English is extremely lousy and they know it... but their employer doesn't. One conversation with you and the whole school knows that teacher can't speak English or communicate.
Most Chinese are afraid of attending special events with foreigners (especially if it is a foreign controlled event). They don't know what to do. They barely even know what to do at their own events (which usually just include, eating, chatting and bit and then immediately leaving).
I would say that 80-85% of Chinese are just non-sociable and very introvert due to the education and society. Usually the ones that learn English well are the extroverts and can be viewed as "crazy" by the rest of society.
If a girl in China goes on a few dates with you out of the office (and not in a group), it means she is already thinking about marriage.
Sometimes they worry that they will look bad hanging around a single man. Once I got married I noticed the teachers in my school would talk to me more. They were already friendly but you could feel that they put effort into not being too nice. Once you are married they then think that you are talking with them just to be friendly and not to sleep with them. It is a weird way of thinking but this is China.
There are certain stigmas in Chinese society like if they hang around and talk to a foreigner too much... they must be interested in that foreigner or sleeping with him. Chinese think like this... Chinese are bored and like to make up tons of gossip.
Some teachers are afraid of foreigners. Why?
Because they don't want to be exposed. It is quite possible their English is extremely lousy and they know it... but their employer doesn't. One conversation with you and the whole school knows that teacher can't speak English or communicate.
Most Chinese are afraid of attending special events with foreigners (especially if it is a foreign controlled event). They don't know what to do. They barely even know what to do at their own events (which usually just include, eating, chatting and bit and then immediately leaving).
I would say that 80-85% of Chinese are just non-sociable and very introvert due to the education and society. Usually the ones that learn English well are the extroverts and can be viewed as "crazy" by the rest of society.
If a girl in China goes on a few dates with you out of the office (and not in a group), it means she is already thinking about marriage.
Yup, it's because their English sucks and they're afraid of losing face if they can't hold a conversation with you.
icnif77:
It's true, but I find it very funny in the same time.
Could Chinese come to the Western school, and communicate with anybody (only) in Chinese?
When I see, they can't express themselves in English, I always add: 'No worries! We're in China, we should speak Chinese....'
dokken:
I f you re in a Chinese teaching school and all the western teachers graduated in Chinese, then I think you'd expect to be able to speak chinese. not that you d get these crappy training schools
icnif77:
That statement to Chinese is 'points to my bag'.
Still, Western society is open to anybody, so knowledge of Chinese language of Western Chinese teachers is (probably) greater than knowledge of English language Chinese English teachers had 'mastered'.
I cut some slack to Chinese, because of the Wall.
I found it very disappointing the Chinese teachers were not sociable. Don't get me wrong, I was fond of them and I have kept in touch with two of them, but the others were lame. Their lives consisted of working, saving, make dinner, watch DVD (never English). They giggled among themselves like 12 year olds. Always polite but there was a wall they had no desire to breakdown and after a while neither did I.
The reasons are a mixture of those mentioned above. Some were scared of just how bad their English was. Could you imagine somebody going to study german for four years at a uk university and not being able to have a simple conversation. What the hell were they doing? Most of them were never interested in the language nor western culture but were just thinking about an easy to get career until they get married.
Outward looking they were not.
I also got the impression that many of the teachers were scared of things that were different i.e foreigners. Did not like interacting, certainly not socializing. Strange if you are learning English but there you go.
Part of it is financial. Your hobbies and socializing which makes you part of who you are, costs money. Something most chinese-english teachers have never had. Hence the uneventfulness of their daily routine. You want friendlier more interesting chinese, you ll need to find more affluent ones not girls who have gone to a normal university.
Though one of the teachers was my favorite person in china. I liked her even more than my foreign friends. Funny crazy person. But for the most part you will need to look elsewhere because you will just be pulling teeth
You got a couple good answers already. I also found that they weren't very interesting.
My hypothesis, is that the vast majority are not curious due to education and culture. More information usually leads to more restrictions and less gratification. They like you to confirm their narrow world views, not challenge them. Teachers already told them everything they need to know about foreignland.
Do you like China? [What kind of person would say no to that?]
Do you like Chinese food? [C'mon just say yes.]
Chinese girls are pretty, no? [Anything but a resounding yes is guaranteed to make you enemies.]
Chinese people are very friendly and kind, aren't they? [They know they're pushing it with the obnoxiousness now...]
FYI, if you answered the above gauntlet with anything but Yes, Yes, Yes, and Yes, a Mainlander feels no need to be polite to you any longer. Chinese teachers will work with you as the job demands from them, but they'll never be your friend if you don't gratify them.
Quinn68:
I consistently answer "no" to the second question, not just to the Chinese English teachers I work with, but to any Chinese person who asks me that. I've gotten sick off this slop more times than I care to count, and I simply can't lie about it anymore. They don't talk to me anymore, but that's not necessarily a bad thing.
royceH:
Hahahaha.... I've taken to answering no to questions 1, 2 and 4. And let me tell you, the truth is liberating! Go on, give it a try. Why not? Fkem!
An upside of this approach is that they don't want to hang around with me anymore.
The only Chinese colleague i became friendly with had spent a couple of years with her husband in Scotland.
She was frustrated with her job and wanted to do so much more, but being Chinese she had to put up with all the sh** the department threw at her.
we would discuss the differences and she would try to modify things as best she could.
however, she was more tied to the departmental nonsense than i was.
We socialized occasionally, but with a husband and son, she was very restricted with her time.
She was one of the very few local teachers to comment on the crap the FT's were put through.
I felt bad when I left that her options were so limited compared to mine
Yes, there definitely is a wall. I agree with the answers above. The reasons are lack of ability, lack of curiosity, lack of confidence and, likely in some cases, contempt for the laowai.
I do have one Chinese English teacher who I can say is my friend. My wife and I regularly socialise with her and her husband.
The others don't give a stuff about me and avoid me at all costs.
There is a wall, and that wall - aside from some of the answers above - is no common interests.
The people I work with only ever seem to talk about money, how much someone's new house cost, how much their new phone or bag cost, how money you can save if you do this or that... they seem to have no real hobbies or interests, have no idea what's happening in the news and are just generally dull people.
Ask what they do in their free time and most will say they watch soaps on tv and sleep.
Maybe they'll go shopping and take photos of their lunch, or themselves trying to look cute to put on wechat.
That's all well and good if that's what you like to do but it bores hell out of me and no doubt they're not interested in anything I am so what's there to talk about?
Eorthisio:
The lack of interests or hobbies among Chinese people makes it sometimes difficult to find topics for Oral Teaching or Language Corners. We can't talk about basketball and videogames during each and every lessons. Attempts to approach different topics will sometimes be successful, often a failure. Most have no will to broaden their horizons. Some students stand out and can talk about anything, I would say 1 clever boy or girl out of every 20 zombies.
dongbeiren:
This is why I find socializing with Chinese to be difficult in general - I can discuss money and materialism to a point but it's incredibly dull when there's just nothing else going on. Gouxiong, I don't attribute this to cultural differences or relativity, more like a complete lack of culture on the part of many mainlanders.As much as I do try to adjust to Chinese ways, I just can't bring myself to associate with people who have nothing more than these kinds of things to talk about.
silverbutton1:
take photos of their lunch. Yeah, I see that activity alot too, but I think its an Asian thing. Never quite understood why its so important to take a photo of what you are eating.
Iron12:
Money, money money..more money. What did you buy? how much did it cost?....ahhh thats too expensive.
Why do they lie?
Is money a substitute for God? or does it represent tangible meaning to life here in China?
Why do they lie so easily?
Sometimes i wonder if staying in this Godless place, I too will become an emptyhead, with no talent, no originality.
Why the lies?
Hence that "Wall" between the Chinese teacher and the foreigner.
during those odd moments of silence, your inner voice speaks so loud....Im quite sure the Chinese teacher hears it...dont you think so?
In my old school, all the teachers' desks were in cubicles, so yes there were walls between us.
I have never worked as a teacher but in my 5 years here, I have had many Chinese acquaintances and girlfriends. About a third of them (including a couple of girlfriends) didn't know English. The biggest wall is their inability to cross the divide into the unfamiliar. As mentioned before, young Chinese people have very few interests. They had no time during their school years to cultivate anything. How can they breach this difference in thought? The only way they have been trained to see the world is thru money and face. How can someone with no hobbies, no real long term goals or ambitions, and no knowledge of the outside world relate with a foreigner? It's almost like teaching color to a blind person. Just last week, an old "girlfriend" contacted me with the idea to travel together during the holiday. She had a yearning to reach out for something, but she didn't know how to touch it. Later, she got cold feet and canceled. Now, I see another message from her on my phone. She wants to try again. I can only imagine her frustration. Can you imagine wanting to do something real with your life, but not having the basis from which to launch your journey? This is their plight. Some continue reaching out, like Vikky. Others just give up. Mei ban fa.
I pondered this myself at times
I have been lucky in that I have made quite a few Chinese friends, some with almost no English abilities, but none of them were from work!
The first place I worked at, they all seemed so boring, and the other foreign teacher and I went to two dinners in the whole year we were there. I suppose it didn't help that by the last few months, all the conflict had led to a complete breakdown in communication between us and the faculty, but hey, they were a bunch of cheating c*nts.
The second place and third place, the staff seemed nice enough, but they never seemed interested in getting to know us foreigners, even though we invited them out a number of times, they sometimes said they would, someday, but they never did.
It is odd, that those who learn English as their major, seem to be least interested in getting to know us. I am friends with a Chinese girl who did German as her major, her English is also excellent, so we get on well, and as I said earlier, there are many friends who don't even speak English, but they seem to have some zest to life that the English teachers just lack.
well, it's not that complicated. it's human nature to want to talk to people with your own language. take the situation the other way round, what if you can speak chinese to certain level but no way native speaker level, you work in your home country and all your colleagues are native speakers but one chinese guy only speaks chinese. i bet most of the times, all of you will just ignore him. you may say hi socially, but no deep conversations. speaking about parties, chinese don't have a party culture. if something doesn't exist in the culture, they will not want to adventure it. oh, btw, adventure is also not something involved in chinese culture.
coineineagh:
i'd want to hang out with the Chinese native speaker for practice, and just out of curiosity. But the, he would probably prove to be a boring, materialistic KTV addict. And when he starts nitpicking my every pronunciation mistake to intentionally discredit me and gain face, I'd stop wasting my time on him entirely.
there is a wall between the teachers and the principles and bosses.the principles and bosses are not nice,they treat people like shit and there is not alot you can do about it.
I was forced to go to the end of year party last year,if I did not go they would have docked a days pay.the other teacher i work with did not go his pay was docked.
stuff like this happens all the time.
The Chinese do harbor a resentment that foreigners make more (much more) than they do. I was even told by a chinese co-worker that I made more than the schools head-master. I find it odd that they seem at times to obsess over this, but yet not think too much into the party member who has 8 girlfriends in 8 different flats that he is paying for. The many millions in RMB that mid to upper party members get from where ever. Puzzling, but true.
There is literally nothing much to talk about with them.
I call it the "emptyhead" syndrome...if you want to talk calculations or about what you had for breakfast its cool...nothing further...outside the box...not easy to do that.
Wali changchang
It's more self imposed these days.
I have noticed the Chinese teachers are rather aloof, self-absorbed and haughty in their methods of teaching.
Their social skills are terrible; horrible conversationalists, boring "all about me" attitudes and intellectually incurious.
Their interpersonal skills are miserable. They only keep to themselves and require the foreigner to make 100% of the effort, only to say they are "shy."
So, I just deal with the foreign teachers and ignore the Chinese ones. I have nothing in common with them and I want to keep it that way.
It's more self imposed these days.
I have noticed the Chinese teachers are rather aloof, self-absorbed and haughty in their methods of teaching.
Their social skills are terrible; horrible conversationalists, boring "all about me" attitudes and intellectually incurious.
Their interpersonal skills are miserable. They only keep to themselves and require the foreigner to make 100% of the effort, only to say they are "shy."
So, I just deal with the foreign teachers and ignore the Chinese ones. I have nothing in common with them and I want to keep it that way.