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Q: Is anyone else sick and tired of the Chinese playing the victim card over everything?
I get that its a tragedy this plane crash and i feel for the victims families. But i am tired of seeing the victims families screaming and hollering like malaysia did this on purpose to spite them. Yes 2/3rds were chinese but that still leaves many families from many other nations. I havent seen any of them pretending to faint or demanding meetings with the leaders of malaysia. And i dont watch that cctv crap. I watch CNN and BBC and read ywestern newsites. And every day its the chinese families acting like idiots.
Its the same thing as these people that get a scrape on the road but lay in the street like they had their veins ripped out while they were alive.
It really seems that chinese really love for shitty things to happen to them so they can hold on to it for eternity and use it as a crutch.
Expect many more protests in beijing against malaysia soon. And for a country that has banned protesting altogether, they sure dont mind if another country is a focus. Anything to change the focus from domestic problems.
It makes me sick seeing them everyday going on. I saw on CNN the poor wife of an american lost. No blame no anger just hope. Im not american but it really made me miss home.
Whilst I have great sympathy for anyone who has lost someone in this disaster I do feel the Chinese reaction is over the top when compared to other reactions. However this is the way Chinese are, it can be seen on tv here every day. Is it the fault of the individuals, I am not entirely sure it is. People here have been conditioned to keep thoughts and feelings to themselves, so when something of this personal magnitude happens it is like a dam bursting and everything is let out. Added to this the idea of compensation, and of course this is a foreign company and therefor must be rich, so financial greed surfaces very fast. Added to this we are all aware of how any foreign person, company or country is really anti China, then in these circumstances China must stand up for herself and in comes the martyr card to play, which of course is not discouraged in any way by those in power and really should know better.
I don't like the reaction of the Chinese to this , or any other, disaster but I do think when it comes down to individuals their reactions are a combination of conditioning and anti foreign sentiment stirred up by particular sections of society.
I've nothing to add. That was an excellent assessment, mike.
Well, they can keep playing this victim card... as I am sure they will but with it comes recoil...
People are starting to dislike Chinese strongly on a global scale. Many hotels/restaurants and countries are starting to turn away the Chinese because they always seem to cause more trouble than their money is worth.
For example, say you take in a group of 50 Chinese in to your restaurant that can hold 200 people or so. You know what happens... the Chinese are loud, arrogant, uncouth and exhibit horrible manners. So you ask them to be quiet, and they play the victim card... "You are picking on us because we are Chinese!" And then things escalate as they demand a compensation...
So not only do you have trouble with those 50, more than likely you got 150 complaining about the Chinese group (which makes them even more up in arms) and then never want to come back to your hotel/restaurant...
All the while, the Chinese blame everyone on the planet but themselves... still playing the victim card.
Despondent Chinese family members should be told, by their own govt., to shut up. Everything that can be done is being done...... Hishammuddin Hussein is doing a fantastic job of keeping his emotions in check.
Chinese reputation as decent human beings is being tarnished by a few.
After an angry visit/holiday in Kuala Lumpur, they will want to go to Perth, and then Britain and France to see what is being done for them there. Then to NTSB headquarters in USA.
All along demanding the best hotels and restaurants and catering ..... and they will continue to demand these perks/vacations every 6 months or so until they themselves have come to a conclusion about the fate of their family member, or they are tired of the travel and pampering and well-earned ridicule.
I live here --in China --- making it my home..... wish they wouldn't make it so disgusting for me......selfish me.
a plane missing in the sea - it could take years to find, let alone discover what happened.
While i have a lot of sympathy for families of the missing, especially as there are so many unanswered questions, the Chinese families should act with some degree of dignity if they want the sympathy to remain with them.
I have regard the MA flight as a jihadist attack directed at China - based on the fact that (1) China is pissing off everybody, including Muslim terrorists...(2) It flew out of KL which is known as a hub for Islamist terrorists, and has high levels of anti China sentiment. So if China is pulling the victim card it is probably accurate in this one case, though I cannot help.but think China has been "asking for it" for a long time.
thefidu881:
If it was a jihadist move, they could have flown the plane to Beijing and crashed there to cause more damage. Please don't act like Uncle Sam until a clue of the plane can be found. There is no such movements in China until backed by some agencies like, Intrusion in Tebit.
Scandinavian:
maybe that was the plan, but the terrorist were over manned by heroic passengers of <pick your nationality>
Amen brother,
but this reaction isn't half as bad as that earthquake in New Zealand a couple years back. Honest to god the official response was like "You need to pay Chinese families more than everyone else because of the 1 child policy"
Ok, so that's an argument that due to demographics Chinese lives have a different value than others.
now WHAT IF, the New Zealand authorities or whoever was in charge had made the argument that "We should pay chinese families LESS compensation because there are so many of them a few lost doesn't matter." How would they have completely flipped out over that?
It's the same premise, some lives are demographically more valuable, just turned two different ways.
If you ever want to really lose respect for someone here, ask them what they think of Nazi Germany. Usually neutral to positive. Then ask about Japan. Racialist, genocidal regimes are OK, so long as they don't hurt China.
It's the morality of a mob boss killing a man who steals from him. He has no problem with stealing, just that he was disrespected.
Totally agree - and not just in this instance (obviously).
So, how interesting it would be if this plane actually ends up being found in Chinese waters, or on Chinese land! (remember, it hasn't been found yet!! Almost impossible, with the amount of land it would need to fly over, but...)
Scandinavian:
found on Chinese land, I can see where you are going with that, but rather than a story of incompetence, the editors at the ministry of truth surely would make a story about the heroic rescue workers dedicated to finding the plane that has all along been stuck in a highrise in a ghost city.
I want to add I think this is more than just a China problem, a lot of people seem to think being a victim is just as good as being a winner...that sympathy is just as good as admiration. It's all attention right?
Wanting victim-status is an insult to all the true victims of horrible people and situations in the world, there are some horrible people out there and sometimes things completely outside of our control can happen.
It was something that was never tolerated/encouraged in my house growing up, and probably more than anything else what defines my personality.
Anytime i'd bitch to my parents about something bad that happened, they'd always make me think about what I could have done differently to get a better outcome. Not in the sense of "it's your fault something bad happened!" but like "you can only control yourself so how do you get good results?"
Guess what? Things have generally gone OK for me.
It's pathetic how they hold up the Chinese flag, like that has anything to do with anything and protest in Malaysia, yet when their own government buries survivors in a train crash they say nothing. They're a people of no character and I'm sick of them.
Percivile:
I have left, like that matters. These idiots spread their idiocy beyond their borders, like the OP displays.
I hope the family of that Irish kid fly en masse to Beijing and demand to know what happened with an Irish flag behind them.
Yeah, relatives gather to ask questions about the flight and vent-off their anger => fine, and the police is nice enough to organize security, they got ample media coverage
10 dudes gather to ask the officials to reveal their wealth => prosecuted and jailed for disturbing civil order.
Neutral view could be: If US can invade one third of the world in result of two plane crashed in to the twin towers then Chinese victims have the right to at least have the information of what happened to their loved ones. Did you ever felt sick of the US and NATO using the victim card of innocent American citizens for more than 12 years to invade other countries? Surely not, so switch on to POGO, Just For Laugh Gags if you are sick of the Chinese victims asking for information at least they are not going to invade Malaysia for that.
expatlife26:
They can't invade malaysia (mutual defense treaty with UK). Who knows what they would do if they could? You don't get a pat on the back for not doing something you are not capable of doing. Like a hobo wanting credit for "one less car on the road" or me wanting praise for not taking private jets. It's good I guess but it's not morality if a decision is made for you.
Also 9/11 was known from day 1 to be a act of aggression aimed at killing innocent civilians. What the US govt. did with regards to foreign policy is debatable (at best), but you didn't see average Americans protesting outside afghan restaurants with tacit govt support.
Though maybe you should have seen Americans protesting outside of the Saudi embassy.
I dunno maybe guess i'm talking myself into agreeing with you a little bit.
JanSk:
This is comparing apples to wrist watches.
9/11 was by every definition an act of war, whilst MH370 is per this day a mystery which can be down to a host of causes ranging from terrorism, murder/suicide, mechanical fault, pilot error or anything else.
The Malaysians aren't trying to keep Chinese families in the dark, the things is, they have no idea what actually happened, right now, nobody knows what has happened to MH370 except for that it probably ended up somewhere in the Indian Ocean.
Scandinavian:
Is Afghanistan a much larger country than I thought ? I mean, a third of the world is pushing is a bit.
mike695ca:
Although i see where your coming from your comparison is still out of whack. 911 was an act of war completely and this.... We have no idea. But there is no indication that this was a sign of any agression towards china. Chinese make up 20% of the world population. If someone takes a shit in Mesa Arizona at least 12 chinese are going to die. I understand the need for wanting someone to blame but their actions make them look like idiots. Blame the malaysian government ...why? Because it had their name on the side of the plane? It doesnt make any sense. Have you seen malaysian people celebrating? Burning chinese flags? No its a tragedy. Plain and simple. If you need someone to blame why not spread it around? Why not Thailand? They had the plane on their radar and didnt say shit for ten days cuz no one asked. Or ummm. Why not Boeing? They kinda made the plane. The simple point is that everyone else from every other country effected is simply waiting for answers that may never come and praying their missing family is safe. While china has a new cause to hate the world and faint and scream. Its sickening.
Shining_brow:
Actually, I can see a valid comparison (highly doubtful, but still logically valid).
I think the Chinese are blaming the Malaysian government for the same reasons that people blamed the US government. Something isn't quite right, and there's suspicions that the governments had something directly to do with the incidents.
The problem, with both scenarios, is that there's a lot not being said, and in some ways, information is trickling out, instead of pouring out.
I, for one, think 9/11 was an inside job, just as I think there are people who know exactly where this plane is... but they ain't saying anything, cos it might "compromise national security" BS.
thefidu881:
@Expart of CIA: First point is this has nothing to do with my origion as if had I could hve bursted out at US for killing thousands of my innocent fellows by foul play. Second is you are not the only authority to issue lincess for who can spek English and who can't as English doesn't come from your grand dad's pocket.
Now lets come to the point, 9/11 was an act of war by CIA or allys against American citizens for two reasons. First, let suppose Al qaeda did that crap. Who raised Al- Qaeda back in 1970s? Anwar Al Sadat of Egypt, CIA and Saudi Government to push back Russia from invading Afghanistan. How? Bin Laden group of Companies has the largest share in the market of Saudi Arabia and Saudi Government didn't want Bin Laden family to be a strong opposition in the country and a threat for the Royal family. CIA sold weapons to Al-Qaeda and trained their terrorists in Afghanistan and Pakistan. I am whacking my own country for their share in the bloody game for I am against any kind of voilence. In short, either 9/11 was plotted by Al-Qaeda or it was internal job US is responsible for that. Shunning eyes from truth will owe you nothing but hatred and deaths US is still bearing in Afghanistan along with the financial burden. Its off topic but its to the point with evidences from your own media as you can consult BBShe or ABC News. American people were fooled over the war against terrorism. Do you know why Bush was elected second time as a President an who plotted a fake video of Al-qaeda threatening America couple of weeks before the election was held? If no, go read your history and learn something real and have the heart to accept reality. Your hard earned money is being used for killings and making weapons of mass distruction. Put a stop to that shit and protest against your government to tell the world truth about 9/11 and Osama Bin Laden.
thefidu881:
@Scandinavian: Afghanistan, Iraq, Tunisia, Libya, Egypt and Syria almost equal to one third of the world. That is exclusive of some minor African countries like Somalia and Nigeria. 
thefidu881:
@Eng: Every action has a reaction, a proven scientific law. As many Zeldas and dollas* are here to make a hell out of nothing, the number of 'mu wao' is still far less. Seems you don't have a fridge, you better ask your neighbors for ice 
.
expatlife26:
Look there are a lot of conspiracy theories about 9/11...but that's all they are, just theories. I mean shit it would be huge news if something really came out about that, but frankly every single theory requires thousands of people to have all been able to keep that massive secret for 13 years.
Pulling off the attacks alone was a pretty big stretch...it could have very easily have ended with at least 1 plane full of hijackers beaten into submission and then exposed.
To be able to do that and then keep every detail of this massive coverup secret is an even greater accomplishment than the attacks themselves.
You talk about how the US govt did this like it's a fact, but it's an assumption you're making based on your opinion of the character of the united states without any hard evidence to back it up and with a good deal of evidence against it.
I think the US is full of shit...but I also think we're pretty much the best case for a sole superpower, by virtue of being a multicultural society with at least some semblance of morality. Can you imagine what it would be like for other countries if a nation like China or frankly ANY Islamic country (not that islam itself is immoral, but it's pretty damned intolerant of other cultures living alongside it) had the power and influence that the United States does? Do you think that China would be more fair in it's dealings with others if they had the leverage the United States does?
We're not perfect, but we at least try our best and I think in general American people have a desire to do the right thing and feel like good people.
thefidu881:
Well ! I agree with you upon need of evidences to reveal the truth which is impossible in my point of view until someone like Edward Snowden get away with it. It will remain a mystery until the US sole superpower status come to an end. I am sure we will see the truth one day.
About Al Qaeda and its organizing by US, if you still are in doubt then I think you haven't read anything except you have been taught in US. Wait a minute, John K Cooly is an American writer who wrote a book named, 'The Unholy War' regarding the making of Al Qaeda to defeat USSR in 1970s. Better have a look at that and please regard Mr. Cooly as Up-Yours.
Regarding Superpower entity I wish no Islamic country should achieve that for the Islam we see nowadays is completely diverted and driven from the true Islam once was centuries ago. The only reason for saying so is that according to Islam, killing a person is equal to killing the humanity and saving one is equal to saving the humanity which perhaps is self explanatory the way Muslims are busy in killing each other and non Muslims.
Lets come to the Doing Right Things. With due apologies if you think killing of thousands Iraqis in the name of Chemical Weapons was RIGHT then you are certainly WRONG. The UN has clearly stated there were no such weapons in Iraq except 'OIL'. You need to apologies to Iraqi nation for murdering and looting their country.
Spying people and using drones to kill people extra judicially is not RIGHT and if you can stomach this, I suggest to commit a collateral suicide. I mean what is that US hasn't done to humanity being a sole power. The amount US spent on the wars and making weapons could have educated 100% of the people who pose a threat to US and the world. You are Right for you can digest this too.
I am 100% sure that China will have much more tolerant approach as a super power than the US for US is far away from the countries she attacked and devastated and China will not get in to such expedition which can cause sever threat to her. Totally my personal assumptions might be WRONG according to people against China.
I love American civilization until 1857. lols 
thefidu881:
@Mike
"If someone takes a shit in Mesa Arizona at least 12 chinese are going to die"
Here's what I was looking for. Chinese are more in population so if a dozen hundred are killed, its not an issue. America is the super power so if 2600 Americans get killed, kill 260000 to avenge. What if the 154 passengers were Americans and Europeans ? Either Malaysia could be under attack by now for boarding two terrorists with theft passports or the plane could have been traced by all means no late than two hours.
expatlife26:
You're absolutely right the CIA trained Al Qaeda.
America does lots of shitty things. But they are less shitty than any other country I can imagine having the drive to become dominant would do.
imagine if Russia had the leverage the US does? The sheer level of corruption unchecked by any other nation?
China? They would force open chinese immigration and try and demographically conquer the world, treat everyone like they treat minorities in China.
Any islamic state? Of course islam as a religion can teach a lot of wonderful things and good values, unfortunately the way it is practiced now would create untold suffering for anyone who is not of the islamic faith.
Feel shame for humanity, American hegemony probably does the least harm out of all the alternatives. That's nothing to be proud of, just something to be conscious of as we strive to improve ourselves.
thefidu881:
Hail Bro! That's the approach. Strive for better life and educate people instead of hatred. I appreciate your thoughts and that's what we common masses need to realize. The governments everywhere sucks in one way or another and the responsibility of keeping balance among human beings remain ours, common citizens.
expatlife26:
I'm glad that's something we can agree on! I enjoyed our discussion. All we can do is try and be fair and decent people in our dealings with others and fight against the irrational biases we all have deep down. Spend more time looking in the mirror than we do pointing fingers. (figuratively, haha. obviously not staring at yourself in the mirror all day)
sam239:
Actually expatlife26 the assertion that US intelligence agencies were behind the formation of Al-Qaeda has been debunked. Senior Al Qaeda officials themselves said so - it's essentially a group funded from the Middle East that used Afghanistan under the Taliban as an operating base. Google "CIA Al Qaeda controversy" for more.
The US did fund the mujahideen in their battle against the USSR, which ultimately backfired, but as a matter of national interest, rather than calculated evil,
Btw I offically call bullshit on Thefidu881. His only question of note is basically "As a simple oral english teacher, shouldn't it be wrong for me to discuss the politics of our gracious host?"
Guess it's fine to discuss the US, which i'm not saying is perfect by any means. We're definitely full of shit in our own special way, but that's not the topic at hand.
"Please don't act like Uncle Sam until a clue of the plane can be found. There is no such movements in China"
i'm not sure that sounds natural, and in any case there was a horrific attack on civillians in kunming quite recently.
As jan and mike said, there is no reason at this point to assume this was an act of aggression against chinese citizens. 9/11 was very clearly an attempt to kill as many US civilians as possible.
thefidu881:
Thank you Bro! I really apreciate your words and have great respect for you.
sam239:
You can file this one in the "suspicious" to "very suspicious" category, no, or am I being a hypocritical conspiracy nut?
Whatever happened was deliberate and expertly planned. The pilots have been profiled to international standard and it does not seem they were behind it. Seems to me an operation like this would require support at the level of nation-states. An entire 777 doesn't just go *p00f*. I bet you a beer it's on the ground intact.
There is one element to this that I don't think people have fully considered... the Five stages of grief.
You know - denial, anger, bargaining, depression , acceptance.
These families have jumped straight into the 'anger' stage, and part of that is blame. Blaming the government, the airline, the rest of the world. So, they're obviously doing something very natural. How they express this may be not what we're used to, but it's how they 'deal' with it
mike695ca:
I think after you have been here a while you will see that china only has 3 stages Anger- How can they do this to the motherland!?!?!?! Bargaining- cry , scream, pretend to die ect. This is their best bargaining chip. Sympathy = free money in China. Acceptance - i accept you cheques. Keep em coming.
Robk:
@mike - haahaha... so true.
Western psychology doesn't really apply here. It's straight to the tears and acting... and pinching the little kids to cry as well until the money is handed over...
I think you shouldn't hurt someone feeling writing such crap, people who lose family members you can't understand that burden, until unless you come under same ....
As said .. everything is funny until unless happening with others ....
While you seem to have a tendency toward putting the blame on "them" for whatever issue an outgroup raises, I can't disagree with your assessment about China's fondness of the victim card. But I believe it isn't intended to get sympathy, empathy and compassion, since I don't see anyone in China willingly displaying these interactions positively. I think the victim card is pulled to stir up nationalistic fury at the perceived embarrassments China suffers at the hands of "them". I have no good words for Chinese victim behaviour, so I think I'll stop here.
Chinese are more money-hungry than I have seen anywhere else before. They play victim and over-exaggerate everything in order to be compensated even if they are in the wrong. I am a tour guide in my country and the Chinese are the worst tourists imaginable. Even worse than the spoilt, demanding Americans. Their manners are atrocious and have no respect for other cultures but they will tell you to respect theirs.
I am equally sick of the need for assigning blame instead of trying to solve problems.
Bus not moving, well, lardida. Let's spend all our efforts in blaming the manufacturer rather than go refuel to get it going again.
The American families probably have life insurance policies. So, they don't really need to overly express their lamentations. Just sayin'.
mike695ca:
Actually in the case of plane crashes the amoint of money each passengers family gets its already kind of locked in. Nothing to do with life insurance. The Montreal accord. Or some other name for an international agreement... I guess theu agreed in Montreal haha.
WCG:
Mike, of course a settlement will be paid. But, I can buy an additional life insurance policy in the USA that will cover my family for life in the case that I am not able to provide for them. I have one actually. The Chinese families may not be satisfied with the settlement being offered. And/or Perhaps the Chinese families are unfamiliar with this Montreal treaty (agreement) you mentioned. I haven't heard of it either. Did China sign on to this agreement/treaty? Probably not. Same reason why you can't legally drive in China holding just your license from back home. China didn't sign that treaty either. International law gets kind of fuzzy when you can't enforce things. Hence the reason for sanctions and war. And for their overly expressed lamentations, right? I mean, China probably won't compensate the families for their loss. So, really it is up to the airline or whoever else is responsible. That's what settlements are for, SHUT UP money. So, they're making it known now that they're not going to shut up very cheaply. I would argue that this "Chinese tactic" is actually a necessity in China, where most Chinese people cannot rely on the legal system to serve justice. So really, I must disagree with your position altogether. I would argue that playing the victim card is a natural reaction of someone who is use to being cheated. Furthermore, maybe the American families are accustomed to an advanced legal system and have never had to deal with an Asian judicial system. So, perhaps the American families should be raising more hell! Knowing what I know now about China, yeah I would be using that camera to make China look really bad to the point where they would be willing to give me a lot of money to shut the f*ck up. That's the way it works here. Vigilante justice. The Chinese play the victim card because that's the only way they know how to get what they want. They can't rely on their judicial system to serve justice. Hell, the USA sees it as a declaration of war and blows up a damn country when it happens. That's not going to happen here. I don't understand your retraction. I thought that was your argument for "lying in the streets with their veins ripped out." Maybe I misunderstood your post.
I always like to play 'victim card'! Especially, when I need day off!
OP; Sorry, I'm having party tonight. I don't think, am really in the 'loop'
I must say, I had a long and entertained reading of all this thread and found so much objective and balanced attitudes regarding the mentioned victims' behavior.
Definitely, this is food for thought. I would never judge any victim given the grief that would affect me enough to genuinely believe it and respect it.
Going this far and pointing out the immorality about it, it's something that proves enough common sense and maybe wish for honesty. Although there's a lot of chance that Mike be mistaken I welcome this insight, even when it may cut you down to the ribs with such truth.
It's hard to find the difference between right and wrong in this country. Prove of it is that honesty and genuine grief can be under serious doubts that people like Mike end up saying "enough it's enough".
Something got wrong in China to the extent that the immorality affects so much the perception of people who feel so tired and confused including at the tears of a grieving mother, father or anyone's tears who lost someone dear in that plane.
Something is wrong indeed that people like Mike have to come here and put it in a way that you can't but think whether the victims hide hope for substantial compensations, at a personal and/or national level.
I see in this whole thread a clear sign of fatigue of all Westerners facing the same deceptive Chinese behavior. Although there is genuine pain and genuine expression of it, people don't believe them anymore. This is like in the fable when the real wolves come and no matter how the ships were yelling about the danger, nobody believed them anymore.
This fatigue is mine too...
...although no matter how misled and misused the pain of those people may be, by the end of the day, when each one goes to his room at night, in the loneliness and absence of the beloved one, the grief is still grief.
Pleading for a quality of it, it requires a lot of effort. I would hardly be able to expect some quality from the victims because I know it is impossible. I would not be able to either expect from them to behave, because that is the right situation when one is fully allowed to be mad and not be blamed for it.
When it comes to death, we all are the same. Nevertheless, it's true that many use this to get the share. I know China proves no respect at all neither for life, nor its citizen's life. But when I see them I only think about me being one of those people who's lost someone dear and can't but feel their despair and respect their tears.
I would never be able to tell them that there is a time for them to behave. Their pain is their pain and I would only choose to let them be in their pain until they find peace. Although they may not go to through the same stages as we do, one day they will certainly reach the reconciliation and peace about their loss. But that day it's not for me to set it. It's personal, it's private and I can't but respect it and learn patience waiting for them to show some common sense, if such thing should be expected under these circumstances.
Mike, side question about something shitty in Shenzhen, are you still here? Did you hear about the road side parking and fee system? Something about electronically charging us after 5 minutes of parking and then we pay it with a phone app? Question what device in our car lets the system know that our car is parked there? If you haven't heard about it check out Shenzhen Daily online for Friday April 4th in the Shenzhen section.
ironman510:
http://mp.weixin.qq.com/s?__biz=MjM5MDc5NzY4MQ==&mid=200078650&idx=1&sn=e01feabd6573d00c31e9d90b94cc94a2#rd
mike695ca:
Hey man, yeah im still here. They dont know which car is parked where. Its just they have sensors underneath the parking spot. And they know a car is there. They just dont know which car. So if a payment is not made then they will send a patrol car to take pics and then charge you after. Seems like a stupid inefficient system.
